the-compact
Road Advisory Committee Wednesday, June 24, 2026 · 70 min

BT Road Advisory Committee Meeting on June 24, 2026

Transcript

Click any timestamp to jump the video to that moment. Auto-transcribed; expect occasional errors on proper nouns.

  1. Approve the minutes of June 10th, 2026. We all got them, I know we did. I moved, I know we did, I moved, support. Move in support, all those in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Okay, call to order, approve the minutes. Public comment, you're the public. Okay, what a beautiful sentence. Well, not for now, yeah, all right, let's move on. There's no public comment. Okay, let's talk about a couple of the recommendations that we need for the report to the Township Board of Trustees. There's a few items we have to do. We have to look at the last meeting, Mindy, you, Fred, you weren't here so you didn't get to present, we didn't get to discuss that with you, so I thought we would put that in this meeting. Okay. And then we want to find out, we want to start working on the PowerPoint, and then we want to select a date from when we want to actually present this to the Board of Trustees. And that might be difficult with the summer with everybody, a lot of people being away in vacations, so we have to figure out a time when almost every, when everybody can be here, hopefully. Okay, so, we went through, last time we went through the other presentations and made some recommendations. I think we have those here. So, Fred, you and Mindy, there were two reports, one on the 23rd and one on the 13th. Thank you. So, we need to, I'm sorry, one was the original, one was the cleaned up version. So which is the, so the one on the 26 third then is the one that, the final. This is the one that I provided and the one. Right, I got it, yeah. Yeah, but I'm just letting that through PowerPoint. Okay, very good, okay. Okay, thank you. Okay, so let's, you all have it in front of you. I read through this quite thoroughly and I made a couple of suggestions. But I want to hear from everybody else if anybody has anything. Let's just open it up, start talking about it. Do you want to go through, maybe you should go through it and talk to us about it. We can go through it. Yeah. Happy to go through it, do you want to? No, go ahead, we'll start it, I'll weigh in. All right. We'll do it together. All right, so the first statement was really looking at just as it says,

  2. Okay, so, we went through, last time we went through the other presentations and made some recommendations. I think we have those here. So, Fred, you and Mindy, there were two reports, one on the 23rd and one on the 13th. Thank you. So, we need to, I'm sorry, one was the original, one was the cleaned up version. So which is the, so the one on the 26 third then is the one that, the final. This is the one that I provided and the one. Right, I got it, yeah. Yeah, but I'm just letting that through PowerPoint. Okay, very good, okay. Okay, thank you. Okay, so let's, you all have it in front of you. I read through this quite thoroughly and I made a couple of suggestions. But I want to hear from everybody else if anybody has anything. Let's just open it up, start talking about it. Do you want to go through, maybe you should go through it and talk to us about it. We can go through it. Yeah. Happy to go through it, do you want to? No, go ahead, we'll start it, I'll weigh in. All right. We'll do it together. All right, so the first statement was really looking at just as it says, the deterioration of the roads being exasperated really increased by the amount of residential construction and the concentration of construction. And in one of the emails that went out last week or so, there was a sort of a citing the number of new home permits. But what that report doesn't reflect is how many houses are still under construction in a given neighborhood. So that's a very good one. Do you know what? Thank you very much. Thank you. You know, so you can say that the township issued 50 permits in 2025 or 2026, whatever year you want to pick, to start new construction of homes. How long in 2025, how many homes were still under construction? And how do you take those permits and allocate them to a neighborhood? And how do you then keep track of when did that permit get the final inspection for being a certificate of occupancy? Because in my neighborhood, houses are taking two and a half to three years to build. And right now, there are, what did we pass?

  3. the deterioration of the roads being exasperated really increased by the amount of residential construction and the concentration of construction. And in one of the emails that went out last week or so, there was a sort of a citing the number of new home permits. But what that report doesn't reflect is how many houses are still under construction in a given neighborhood. So that's a very good one. Do you know what? Thank you very much. Thank you. You know, so you can say that the township issued 50 permits in 2025 or 2026, whatever year you want to pick, to start new construction of homes. How long in 2025, how many homes were still under construction? And how do you take those permits and allocate them to a neighborhood? And how do you then keep track of when did that permit get the final inspection for being a certificate of occupancy? Because in my neighborhood, houses are taking two and a half to three years to build. And right now, there are, what did we pass? We passed five or six that are in various stages of construction right now. There's still two or three empty lots, and there's three or four that I know that the certificate of occupancies were issued earlier this year. So we need to be looking at not just what's happening to the roads. It's this paradox where the road commission owns the roads, but the township has to have some responsibility over the permitting process. And that's what this really comes down to. And then the construction just contributes materially to preexisting road asset degradation. I know that I've had this argument with people at the Road Commission before, and they all want to say that roads were built for certain loads. The reality of life is that you can look down roads in any neighborhood. I'm obviously more familiar with my neighborhood. And the roads that have houses, when multiple houses are under construction, you can see obvious accelerated deterioration of the roads. Now, maybe that's anecdotal information.

  4. And right now, there are, what did we pass? We passed five or six that are in various stages of construction right now. There's still two or three empty lots, and there's three or four that I know that the certificate of occupancies were issued earlier this year. So we need to be looking at not just what's happening to the roads. It's this paradox where the road commission owns the roads, but the township has to have some responsibility over the permitting process. And that's what this really comes down to. And then the construction just contributes materially to preexisting road asset degradation. I know that I've had this argument with people at the Road Commission before, and they all want to say that roads were built for certain loads. The reality of life is that you can look down roads in any neighborhood. I'm obviously more familiar with my neighborhood. And the roads that have houses, when multiple houses are under construction, you can see obvious accelerated deterioration of the roads. Now, maybe that's anecdotal information. But the reality is that what we're really looking here is for the township to acknowledge the fact that there's a cause and effect relationship between the number of permits that you're issuing for new housing construction, the density of how you're issuing those permits, and how long those permits stay open. And those should be things that are within our control. There are things that we should be controlling in order to make sure that we're not condensing construction into a specific neighborhood. Now, obviously, if there's a whole new subdivision going in, that's a different story. But that's not the case in most of our neighborhoods. We talk about the impact is especially burdensome to older residents. You know, right now, the only solution is, all right, the roads are getting torn up. The roads are bad. Sucks being you, homeowner. When they're going to nest with a road. The roads, the road. The roads are not near home. What? help you get an SAD you get to pay for the road you know that's just taxation because we're not doing our job as a township in my opinion and so let's look at making sure that if we can own the problem then we can control what we can

  5. Now, maybe that's anecdotal information. But the reality is that what we're really looking here is for the township to acknowledge the fact that there's a cause and effect relationship between the number of permits that you're issuing for new housing construction, the density of how you're issuing those permits, and how long those permits stay open. And those should be things that are within our control. There are things that we should be controlling in order to make sure that we're not condensing construction into a specific neighborhood. Now, obviously, if there's a whole new subdivision going in, that's a different story. But that's not the case in most of our neighborhoods. We talk about the impact is especially burdensome to older residents. You know, right now, the only solution is, all right, the roads are getting torn up. The roads are bad. Sucks being you, homeowner. When they're going to nest with a road. The roads, the road. The roads are not near home. What? help you get an SAD you get to pay for the road you know that's just taxation because we're not doing our job as a township in my opinion and so let's look at making sure that if we can own the problem then we can control what we can control right now the township isn't even collecting data on the basis of how this how these permits are being issued and how they're impacting specific neighborhoods next slide next slide is a current asset cycle of degradation I think this just it still just restates what we said pace of new home construction is accelerated significantly you know my my neighborhood I moved in my neighborhood 22 years ago and a 4,000 square foot house was in the 95th percentile of size in the neighborhood most of the homes were were sub 3,000 square feet eighty percent of them had no basements today that 44,000 square foot house is in the 15 to 20th percentile of homes in the neighborhood because nothing is going in that's under five to six thousand square feet in fact we drove by Mindy and I drove through my neighborhood just so somebody else could corroborate some of the things you you

  6. at making sure that if we can own the problem then we can control what we can control right now the township isn't even collecting data on the basis of how this how these permits are being issued and how they're impacting specific neighborhoods next slide next slide is a current asset cycle of degradation I think this just it still just restates what we said pace of new home construction is accelerated significantly you know my my neighborhood I moved in my neighborhood 22 years ago and a 4,000 square foot house was in the 95th percentile of size in the neighborhood most of the homes were were sub 3,000 square feet eighty percent of them had no basements today that 44,000 square foot house is in the 15 to 20th percentile of homes in the neighborhood because nothing is going in that's under five to six thousand square feet in fact we drove by Mindy and I drove through my neighborhood just so somebody else could corroborate some of the things you you that I'm saying, in one particular case, a homeowner bought the one-acre lot next to their house. They already had a 4,500-square-foot house. They doubled the size of the house. They now have a 9,000-square-foot house covering two acres of lot. And it's interesting. It's nice. I'm not against new houses going in. But the size of these homes is massive. And when you start looking at putting up a 6,000-plus-square-foot house with a full basement with a 9- to 10-foot ceiling, you're talking about removing more than a million pounds of just dirt from the construction site. So we have to be more cognizant of what are the things that we can control. The next slide just talks about the disconnect, which just makes things a little bit crazy. Because RCOC owns the roads. Oakland County and Bloomfield Township don't have any ownership of the roads. But they both collect taxes from properties that are living

  7. that I'm saying, in one particular case, a homeowner bought the one-acre lot next to their house. They already had a 4,500-square-foot house. They doubled the size of the house. They now have a 9,000-square-foot house covering two acres of lot. And it's interesting. It's nice. I'm not against new houses going in. But the size of these homes is massive. And when you start looking at putting up a 6,000-plus-square-foot house with a full basement with a 9- to 10-foot ceiling, you're talking about removing more than a million pounds of just dirt from the construction site. So we have to be more cognizant of what are the things that we can control. The next slide just talks about the disconnect, which just makes things a little bit crazy. Because RCOC owns the roads. Oakland County and Bloomfield Township don't have any ownership of the roads. But they both collect taxes from properties that are living on those roads. I think that that's not something that's likely to change anytime soon. but we can certainly look at- at how do we control the things that we can control. One of the things that Jeff talked about earlier prior to the meeting when him and I were kind of sidebarring was is that he took some exception to the bullet that says the township benefits significantly from increased tax revenue. All right, so if we take the word significantly out, it doesn't change the meaning of the sentence. Well, I think you need to do more than that. What's that? I think you should take the whole sentence out. Why? Well, because how do you know that's true? We went through that last week. The last meeting, the assessor spoke and said a million-dollar home, although it's about $18,000 of taxes, of that, only $5,000 goes to the township. The rest goes helter-skelter all over, schools and the county and all sorts of other, the library, all sorts of other places. But a million-dollar home nets to the township

  8. But they both collect taxes from properties that are living on those roads. I think that that's not something that's likely to change anytime soon. but we can certainly look at- at how do we control the things that we can control. One of the things that Jeff talked about earlier prior to the meeting when him and I were kind of sidebarring was is that he took some exception to the bullet that says the township benefits significantly from increased tax revenue. All right, so if we take the word significantly out, it doesn't change the meaning of the sentence. Well, I think you need to do more than that. What's that? I think you should take the whole sentence out. Why? Well, because how do you know that's true? We went through that last week. The last meeting, the assessor spoke and said a million-dollar home, although it's about $18,000 of taxes, of that, only $5,000 goes to the township. The rest goes helter-skelter all over, schools and the county and all sorts of other, the library, all sorts of other places. But a million-dollar home nets to the township just a smidge under $5,000. Well, that's almost a third, so we can just take significantly out. So the facts of the matter are that, well, why wouldn't we say that? It's actually true. It's not an emotional statement. It's just true. We know that. That's what happens, and that's, frankly, probably what should happen when a new home is built. So that's okay. It's just a statement of fact. It's not, there's nothing that's controversial about this statement. Yeah, I don't think, I don't... Let's move on and go through the... report and then we can answer questions maybe maybe that would be better well i we we let's let's stay up we can do either one but the reality but the reality of life is is that i i'm opposed to taking the whole thing out if if the committee wants to take the whole thing out they can do it over my objection or and mindy's objection of course but the reality of life is is that the township does benefit from increased tax revenue and the township is responsible for issuing permits for the houses that generate that revenue those are facts now if we want to dispute the facts let's dispute the facts or you could say the township benefits however it's not very significant why if if we're if if we have to take out the word significantly

  9. But a million-dollar home nets to the township just a smidge under $5,000. Well, that's almost a third, so we can just take significantly out. So the facts of the matter are that, well, why wouldn't we say that? It's actually true. It's not an emotional statement. It's just true. We know that. That's what happens, and that's, frankly, probably what should happen when a new home is built. So that's okay. It's just a statement of fact. It's not, there's nothing that's controversial about this statement. Yeah, I don't think, I don't... Let's move on and go through the... report and then we can answer questions maybe maybe that would be better well i we we let's let's stay up we can do either one but the reality but the reality of life is is that i i'm opposed to taking the whole thing out if if the committee wants to take the whole thing out they can do it over my objection or and mindy's objection of course but the reality of life is is that the township does benefit from increased tax revenue and the township is responsible for issuing permits for the houses that generate that revenue those are facts now if we want to dispute the facts let's dispute the facts or you could say the township benefits however it's not very significant why if if we're if if we have to take out the word significantly then why would we put in a word that says less significant or just change we're adding another superfluous word that doesn't change the meaning of the sentence well if i may we agreed last time to only the report should be merely recommendations and so these factual background these statements that we're talking about and discussing if we only say recommendations when we're discussing something that's not a recommendation so we're we're we're trying to keep it simple and straightforward for the trustees right so so this all of us not not just one one group all of us have cut out our background discussion points all we're trying to do like this was my point a couple minutes ago we just want to get through this then we can talk about recommendations we're just giving up the group okay because we weren't here so we're simply trying to share right right and then we can take things out we're saying these are recommendations this is leading up to recommendations right right so don't we're on the same page okay but we also talked about in the meeting that you're referencing we also talked

  10. however it's not very significant why if if we're if if we have to take out the word significantly then why would we put in a word that says less significant or just change we're adding another superfluous word that doesn't change the meaning of the sentence well if i may we agreed last time to only the report should be merely recommendations and so these factual background these statements that we're talking about and discussing if we only say recommendations when we're discussing something that's not a recommendation so we're we're we're trying to keep it simple and straightforward for the trustees right so so this all of us not not just one one group all of us have cut out our background discussion points all we're trying to do like this was my point a couple minutes ago we just want to get through this then we can talk about recommendations we're just giving up the group okay because we weren't here so we're simply trying to share right right and then we can take things out we're saying these are recommendations this is leading up to recommendations right right so don't we're on the same page okay but we also talked about in the meeting that you're referencing we also talked about the fact that we would present recommendations to the to the township trustees but that we would also give them a packet that had the background that led up to those recommendations yeah we did so that would be the supporting information and this would be part of the supporting information that would go to them now it wouldn't be presented live at the meeting as the recommendation but but we would go on record of saying you all have the documentation that formatted everything that we did that led to these recommendations you know what let's let's do what mindy suggests okay go through the rest of it and then we'll come back and go point by point whoever needs has any anything they want okay just the recommendation you want to go through current uh where are we current proposed let's so we're on the next i don't know it's the next slide let me go back current proposed solution yeah can we do one more there we okay modify the current new home slash significant home construction permitting process we talked about that a bit already engage a subject matter expert to codify the pre-existing permitting process we don't know what it is but it

  11. on the same page okay but we also talked about in the meeting that you're referencing we also talked about the fact that we would present recommendations to the to the township trustees but that we would also give them a packet that had the background that led up to those recommendations yeah we did so that would be the supporting information and this would be part of the supporting information that would go to them now it wouldn't be presented live at the meeting as the recommendation but but we would go on record of saying you all have the documentation that formatted everything that we did that led to these recommendations you know what let's let's do what mindy suggests okay go through the rest of it and then we'll come back and go point by point whoever needs has any anything they want okay just the recommendation you want to go through current uh where are we current proposed let's so we're on the next i don't know it's the next slide let me go back current proposed solution yeah can we do one more there we okay modify the current new home slash significant home construction permitting process we talked about that a bit already engage a subject matter expert to codify the pre-existing permitting process we don't know what it is but it would be great to have it delineated include a database review which includes a longitudinal period of time we suggested ten years could be less or more permitting data to incorporate permit data so that we could look at the data points that are relevant to how the process is conducted design a modified process if we believe as a result of one two and three to incorporate a small amount of fee that would attach fixing the roads near and in front of the construction to connect a causative relationship here between road degradation because of everything that Fred just described with the amount of activity on the road and the weight of the activity and then recommend fee repurposing to fix the roads because of the cause-and-effect relationship that's the proposed solution and the next slide which is the last one are the summary recommendations so you can read those they are redundant from what I just articulated except to add in

  12. to codify the pre-existing permitting process we don't know what it is but it would be great to have it delineated include a database review which includes a longitudinal period of time we suggested ten years could be less or more permitting data to incorporate permit data so that we could look at the data points that are relevant to how the process is conducted design a modified process if we believe as a result of one two and three to incorporate a small amount of fee that would attach fixing the roads near and in front of the construction to connect a causative relationship here between road degradation because of everything that Fred just described with the amount of activity on the road and the weight of the activity and then recommend fee repurposing to fix the roads because of the cause-and-effect relationship that's the proposed solution and the next slide which is the last one are the summary recommendations so you can read those they are redundant from what I just articulated except to add in with rcoc to implement spot checks for heavy trucks work with rcoc to modify regulations and prohibit the large tandem trucks from residential road use to again mitigate damage and when we talk to rcoc they could not eliminate tandem trucks completely because they could they if they're doing construction on a major road they they have cut-through roads but they could with our recommendation with the recommendation of the township they could restrict those tandem trucks from being on non-cut-through roads but that recommendation would have to come from the township itself i'm sorry what's a non-cut-through road residential yeah well just a plain residential road yeah in my neighborhood lincoln is a cut-through road okay old mill is an officer is not a non-cut-through road losser is a main road um but the road the street that i live on which is wedgwood um connects to two other streets it's it's not a straight cut-through road the rcoc trust me rcoc has a very clear i'm sure they do definition of what a cut-through road is and what is not

  13. with rcoc to implement spot checks for heavy trucks work with rcoc to modify regulations and prohibit the large tandem trucks from residential road use to again mitigate damage and when we talk to rcoc they could not eliminate tandem trucks completely because they could they if they're doing construction on a major road they they have cut-through roads but they could with our recommendation with the recommendation of the township they could restrict those tandem trucks from being on non-cut-through roads but that recommendation would have to come from the township itself i'm sorry what's a non-cut-through road residential yeah well just a plain residential road yeah in my neighborhood lincoln is a cut-through road okay old mill is an officer is not a non-cut-through road losser is a main road um but the road the street that i live on which is wedgwood um connects to two other streets it's it's not a straight cut-through road the rcoc trust me rcoc has a very clear i'm sure they do definition of what a cut-through road is and what is not and and what we looked at which which isn't in here but what we looked at is is that the township should be keeping records that from our perspective they should be keeping records that look at like you said the permitting process the density of the permitting process the longevity of the permitting process and add we would propose a one percent road tax if you would however you want to word it but a fee that would be assessed to the construction of the new house now when you think about that on a two and a half million dollar house that's twenty five thousand dollars it's a rounding error for the person that's buying the house it's not going to deter people from moving into our township with large lots and cheap taxes but it is going to be a amount of money that could be used to offset the road road repairs for that particular neighborhood what kind of repairs could be affected for twenty five thousand dollars it would be a fund that wouldn't necessarily be immediately following construction but we would propose that it would be an amount of money that

  14. has a very clear i'm sure they do definition of what a cut-through road is and what is not and and what we looked at which which isn't in here but what we looked at is is that the township should be keeping records that from our perspective they should be keeping records that look at like you said the permitting process the density of the permitting process the longevity of the permitting process and add we would propose a one percent road tax if you would however you want to word it but a fee that would be assessed to the construction of the new house now when you think about that on a two and a half million dollar house that's twenty five thousand dollars it's a rounding error for the person that's buying the house it's not going to deter people from moving into our township with large lots and cheap taxes but it is going to be a amount of money that could be used to offset the road road repairs for that particular neighborhood what kind of repairs could be affected for twenty five thousand dollars it would be a fund that wouldn't necessarily be immediately following construction but we would propose that it would be an amount of money that the township would collect and allocate it to repairs that need to be done in that neighborhood at a future time i apologize my question was what can you buy we don't know we're not road engineers for twenty five thousand dollars we would have the township and road commission well i think the point is that if every new home put in that much into a fund there would be money to do certain things with Not just the one house, but if you have 50 homes being built, this is what I think they're saying. If you have 50 homes being built, each one has $25,000, let's just argue, it creates a pot of money. Now, it can be used in different places, not just there, but that big pot could be used to mitigate some costs in some places. That's all. I think that's the point. Yeah, quite honestly, it's not an amount of money that would deter construction. $25,000? One percent. One percent. Fred, how do you get that? How do you figure that? You have to have all the building costs then somehow? Yeah, I mean, the township has construction permits from the builder, so you take the cost of the lot, the cost of the construction of the house, and that's your total cost.

  15. immediately following construction but we would propose that it would be an amount of money that the township would collect and allocate it to repairs that need to be done in that neighborhood at a future time i apologize my question was what can you buy we don't know we're not road engineers for twenty five thousand dollars we would have the township and road commission well i think the point is that if every new home put in that much into a fund there would be money to do certain things with Not just the one house, but if you have 50 homes being built, this is what I think they're saying. If you have 50 homes being built, each one has $25,000, let's just argue, it creates a pot of money. Now, it can be used in different places, not just there, but that big pot could be used to mitigate some costs in some places. That's all. I think that's the point. Yeah, quite honestly, it's not an amount of money that would deter construction. $25,000? One percent. One percent. Fred, how do you get that? How do you figure that? You have to have all the building costs then somehow? Yeah, I mean, the township has construction permits from the builder, so you take the cost of the lot, the cost of the construction of the house, and that's your total cost. Now, if you're dealing with a new house being built by a builder, typically the builder has purchased the lot and is reselling the lot to the homeowner. It makes it easy. And where would that money go to? It would go to the township, and the township would allocate a fund, and then they would sort of delineate the fund by neighborhood. Well, it's like an escrow fund. Yeah, it's an escrow. Or a bucket fund. Well, this is a very interesting topic to have conversation about because I'm not so much Fred's neighborhood. I know your neighborhood, which is getting inundated because of this. the size of the lots with new big homes but i think of like westchester village jeff where you are those roads are terrible and yet those are ranch homes again being torn down and dual homes for two and a half million are being sold what are they five thousand square feet yeah something yeah and if i were starting over again and now that i i start looking at roads when i'm driving through neighborhoods and i have to tell you it's not a bad idea because if i know i'm putting up a big home making this expense i know i'm putting something towards a road repair replacement

  16. Yeah, I mean, the township has construction permits from the builder, so you take the cost of the lot, the cost of the construction of the house, and that's your total cost. Now, if you're dealing with a new house being built by a builder, typically the builder has purchased the lot and is reselling the lot to the homeowner. It makes it easy. And where would that money go to? It would go to the township, and the township would allocate a fund, and then they would sort of delineate the fund by neighborhood. Well, it's like an escrow fund. Yeah, it's an escrow. Or a bucket fund. Well, this is a very interesting topic to have conversation about because I'm not so much Fred's neighborhood. I know your neighborhood, which is getting inundated because of this. the size of the lots with new big homes but i think of like westchester village jeff where you are those roads are terrible and yet those are ranch homes again being torn down and dual homes for two and a half million are being sold what are they five thousand square feet yeah something yeah and if i were starting over again and now that i i start looking at roads when i'm driving through neighborhoods and i have to tell you it's not a bad idea because if i know i'm putting up a big home making this expense i know i'm putting something towards a road repair replacement yeah well and you would have control the big thing is you'd have control where it got used well it's a cost to the homeowner because it stays on that because it stays well yeah at least it stays in that neighborhood you know whether it stays specifically on that road if you're going to have a fund to do something it would be anything that you think is construction related that deteriorated the road anywhere so it could be repaired anywhere yeah not just that not just in that the idea that you're going to you're going to be able to to pair it into just that neighborhood i don't know that that's right i think if you're going to do it if you're going to do something you you it should be a fund for all the the construction whether or not it was a new home or not well the only thing i think the reason they're thinking like that is because they're getting hit with these sads and this helps to underwrite the sad going forward for that for that road in that neighborhood and and i guess that i wasn't clear but i was are you tying it to a home or that you know the adjacent roads to get to that that home or are you just putting into one big pot yeah I think if you put it in the one big pot well if I the politics of whoever's managing the pot will spend it

  17. big home making this expense i know i'm putting something towards a road repair replacement yeah well and you would have control the big thing is you'd have control where it got used well it's a cost to the homeowner because it stays on that because it stays well yeah at least it stays in that neighborhood you know whether it stays specifically on that road if you're going to have a fund to do something it would be anything that you think is construction related that deteriorated the road anywhere so it could be repaired anywhere yeah not just that not just in that the idea that you're going to you're going to be able to to pair it into just that neighborhood i don't know that that's right i think if you're going to do it if you're going to do something you you it should be a fund for all the the construction whether or not it was a new home or not well the only thing i think the reason they're thinking like that is because they're getting hit with these sads and this helps to underwrite the sad going forward for that for that road in that neighborhood and and i guess that i wasn't clear but i was are you tying it to a home or that you know the adjacent roads to get to that that home or are you just putting into one big pot yeah I think if you put it in the one big pot well if I the politics of whoever's managing the pot will spend it inappropriately inappropriate inappropriate if you put in one big yeah well that's what I was saying so you're trying to tie it to that two million dollars twenty thousand dollars to that particular road the recommendation is is that you tie it to the neighborhood that that the that the revenue came from got it that's because the the damage to the roads didn't necessarily happen all of it to that house or the road in front of that that's what it was yeah yeah but you're tying it to a particular area rather than the entire township right okay right however a lot of a lot of administrative I think the building the builder point of view it would be worth getting a new road right in front of the house he's building because his value of their house would be you know a lot more curb appeal and actually while we click East Drive the builder this is like few years ago build a new home and about I would say 200 feet of payment they replaced it and I don't think there was a township fund or anything they

  18. well if I the politics of whoever's managing the pot will spend it inappropriately inappropriate inappropriate if you put in one big yeah well that's what I was saying so you're trying to tie it to that two million dollars twenty thousand dollars to that particular road the recommendation is is that you tie it to the neighborhood that that the that the revenue came from got it that's because the the damage to the roads didn't necessarily happen all of it to that house or the road in front of that that's what it was yeah yeah but you're tying it to a particular area rather than the entire township right okay right however a lot of a lot of administrative I think the building the builder point of view it would be worth getting a new road right in front of the house he's building because his value of their house would be you know a lot more curb appeal and actually while we click East Drive the builder this is like few years ago build a new home and about I would say 200 feet of payment they replaced it and I don't think there was a township fund or anything they street so that part in front of that house looks really nice only on that side of the street yeah anyways if i was builder i would say yeah you know okay you know if you're doing that uh it's gonna add to my value here's an issue with that okay i get i get what you're saying that that the builder in my in westchester they're building these big homes and the big trucks are busting up the streets etc etc whatever and so like okay supposing it happens this way supposing you do that okay and 25 000 from every home that's being built you have 30 new homes in the subdivision and the subdivision then goes to an sad that's how it's rebuilt and then and the subdivision says no which happens all the time they won't do it that's not what happened in bloomfield village i know that happened in westchester i know i'm just saying it doesn't happen all the time and as a result it's let me just as a result i sit here in a mike knows this in one section of bloomfield village and there's another one and clay is part of the same thing and we are spending seventy five thousand dollars a home for 75 linear feet there's no relief that's the cost to us in bloomfield village to this

  19. street so that part in front of that house looks really nice only on that side of the street yeah anyways if i was builder i would say yeah you know okay you know if you're doing that uh it's gonna add to my value here's an issue with that okay i get i get what you're saying that that the builder in my in westchester they're building these big homes and the big trucks are busting up the streets etc etc whatever and so like okay supposing it happens this way supposing you do that okay and 25 000 from every home that's being built you have 30 new homes in the subdivision and the subdivision then goes to an sad that's how it's rebuilt and then and the subdivision says no which happens all the time they won't do it that's not what happened in bloomfield village i know that happened in westchester i know i'm just saying it doesn't happen all the time and as a result it's let me just as a result i sit here in a mike knows this in one section of bloomfield village and there's another one and clay is part of the same thing and we are spending seventy five thousand dollars a home for 75 linear feet there's no relief that's the cost to us in bloomfield village to this day the person across the street just pays the same amount it's 150k for 75 feet that is not a solution we need to come up with better solutions my point is what happens if we they take this money and put it this you a pot for that subdivision, and that subdivision doesn't approve an SAD. What happens then? Where does that money go? Well, that money, though, might encourage them to move forward with an SAD where we haven't had a pot in the past, and then you just keep it invested so that it would get interest and grow, I would suspect, but it should stay with that home in that neighborhood because they're the ones making the investment in there. So what you're saying is that because that money's there, the chances are much greater that they will approve an SAD. Yeah. That's what happened in Bloomfield Village. The last sections were approved because there was financial relief, and the price went from $55,000 down to $39,000. That was material, gentlemen, to the people that live in the fifth section of Bloomfield Village, and it passed. It mattered to the individual homeowners to take a price point of the mid-50s down to $39,000.

  20. dollars a home for 75 linear feet there's no relief that's the cost to us in bloomfield village to this day the person across the street just pays the same amount it's 150k for 75 feet that is not a solution we need to come up with better solutions my point is what happens if we they take this money and put it this you a pot for that subdivision, and that subdivision doesn't approve an SAD. What happens then? Where does that money go? Well, that money, though, might encourage them to move forward with an SAD where we haven't had a pot in the past, and then you just keep it invested so that it would get interest and grow, I would suspect, but it should stay with that home in that neighborhood because they're the ones making the investment in there. So what you're saying is that because that money's there, the chances are much greater that they will approve an SAD. Yeah. That's what happened in Bloomfield Village. The last sections were approved because there was financial relief, and the price went from $55,000 down to $39,000. That was material, gentlemen, to the people that live in the fifth section of Bloomfield Village, and it passed. It mattered to the individual homeowners to take a price point of the mid-50s down to $39,000. Yeah. I think that's really the key is that this isn't going to be, this isn't a solution that's going to make road repairs to the neighborhood cash zero, but it reduces the impact on the homeowner. And it reduces the impact on the homeowner by making the person coming into the neighborhood sort of pay it for. So I'm going to go ahead and put it back in the building. And I'm going to go ahead and put it back in the building. So it's a way to keep it. You know what that reminds me of is the college savings fund. You can put money aside for your children when they're born early on and then when they become college ready, that has grown and it helps offset the cost. I think it's a very valid suggestion. I like it. I just want to be sure of how it's going to be applied. And how we manage it. And we can talk about the complexity of managing it, but quite frankly, guys, it's software. It's software that they don't do right now, so you're going to have to teach them how to do it. It's software that you buy. It's a spreadsheet. Well, we're not involved in the implementation. Exactly. I think the concept is good.

  21. Yeah. I think that's really the key is that this isn't going to be, this isn't a solution that's going to make road repairs to the neighborhood cash zero, but it reduces the impact on the homeowner. And it reduces the impact on the homeowner by making the person coming into the neighborhood sort of pay it for. So I'm going to go ahead and put it back in the building. And I'm going to go ahead and put it back in the building. So it's a way to keep it. You know what that reminds me of is the college savings fund. You can put money aside for your children when they're born early on and then when they become college ready, that has grown and it helps offset the cost. I think it's a very valid suggestion. I like it. I just want to be sure of how it's going to be applied. And how we manage it. And we can talk about the complexity of managing it, but quite frankly, guys, it's software. It's software that they don't do right now, so you're going to have to teach them how to do it. It's software that you buy. It's a spreadsheet. Well, we're not involved in the implementation. Exactly. I think the concept is good. And if you waited 10 years to replace the road, let's just say, how much would that money be worth? It would be worth a lot. And that's my point. And making an investment today for tomorrow is a good move. I don't know, but it would be worth a hell of a lot more. Let's say you made 4% on it or something like that. Yeah, the cost goes up. And then, now you go to the people and say, well, we're going to redo our roads. It's $5,000 for you to do it because we have all this money saved up. I think it would be a great incentive. Okay. Yeah, I agree. I think it's a good concept. And it goes back to the previous statements before that that Mindy was reading is that we're not trying to tell them how to implement it. We're recommending go hire a subject matter expert. Or someone in your office. Go hire experts that will tell you exactly how to do this. and what is the state-of-the-art methodology the best thing is it doesn't get pumped punt punted to the RCOC right right it stays in the township and if you don't like it you can get a new super supervisor or something we could we might okay that's nothing anyway those are our recommendations so thank you for letting us go through for half an hour that was good the idea that you

  22. I think the concept is good. And if you waited 10 years to replace the road, let's just say, how much would that money be worth? It would be worth a lot. And that's my point. And making an investment today for tomorrow is a good move. I don't know, but it would be worth a hell of a lot more. Let's say you made 4% on it or something like that. Yeah, the cost goes up. And then, now you go to the people and say, well, we're going to redo our roads. It's $5,000 for you to do it because we have all this money saved up. I think it would be a great incentive. Okay. Yeah, I agree. I think it's a good concept. And it goes back to the previous statements before that that Mindy was reading is that we're not trying to tell them how to implement it. We're recommending go hire a subject matter expert. Or someone in your office. Go hire experts that will tell you exactly how to do this. and what is the state-of-the-art methodology the best thing is it doesn't get pumped punt punted to the RCOC right right it stays in the township and if you don't like it you can get a new super supervisor or something we could we might okay that's nothing anyway those are our recommendations so thank you for letting us go through for half an hour that was good the idea that you put in here a recommendation it could be it's got to be I suppose refined significantly but the building permit process and you talked about we should in there in your talk you said to control where the new building is so that it's so that it's not concentrated in one something well the point that let me just let me just make my point you can't if a new sub of the subdivision all sudden becomes very attractive and people want to sell their houses and and they're going to rebuild I don't think I don't think we have a right to tell people that we you can't do that because we don't want you to in other words in West Chester Village for instance I've used my exam you usually mine until 2003 we're only allowed to have single family I'm sorry of course single single ranches one floor oh three bedroom ranches and that was it that was the difference 2003 so that was a deed restriction so there was no building I mean you couldn't do it nobody and people moving out and families are moving out so then we changed the deed restrictions to allow a second story all of a sudden they said whoa now we can knock this down or add to it we can knock it down we can build

  23. you for letting us go through for half an hour that was good the idea that you put in here a recommendation it could be it's got to be I suppose refined significantly but the building permit process and you talked about we should in there in your talk you said to control where the new building is so that it's so that it's not concentrated in one something well the point that let me just let me just make my point you can't if a new sub of the subdivision all sudden becomes very attractive and people want to sell their houses and and they're going to rebuild I don't think I don't think we have a right to tell people that we you can't do that because we don't want you to in other words in West Chester Village for instance I've used my exam you usually mine until 2003 we're only allowed to have single family I'm sorry of course single single ranches one floor oh three bedroom ranches and that was it that was the difference 2003 so that was a deed restriction so there was no building I mean you couldn't do it nobody and people moving out and families are moving out so then we changed the deed restrictions to allow a second story all of a sudden they said whoa now we can knock this down or add to it we can knock it down we can build so in this scenario that you're suggesting I'm asking I'm throwing this out as devil's advocate would you be able would you saying to that so that subdivision no you can only do five homes a year we don't want you to do that many well I'm just asking as a devil's advocate right so the recommendation is that you start off by tracking the density of housing permits and the length of time between issuing a permit and a occupancy certificate I said in my neighborhood and my name is two and a half to three years and so now you're looking at understanding the density of construction that's going on in a neighborhood you have the opportunity to then hire a subject matter expert to say what should you be talking to the neighborhood associations about and what level of authority do you want to give the neighborhood associations over do you want to restrict the number of construct open constructions that can happen in your neighborhood at a given point in time or do you not we're not trying to get we're not trying to implement but these are things that we can recommend that should be discussed with a subject matter expert that would then come into the township

  24. whoa now we can knock this down or add to it we can knock it down we can build so in this scenario that you're suggesting I'm asking I'm throwing this out as devil's advocate would you be able would you saying to that so that subdivision no you can only do five homes a year we don't want you to do that many well I'm just asking as a devil's advocate right so the recommendation is that you start off by tracking the density of housing permits and the length of time between issuing a permit and a occupancy certificate I said in my neighborhood and my name is two and a half to three years and so now you're looking at understanding the density of construction that's going on in a neighborhood you have the opportunity to then hire a subject matter expert to say what should you be talking to the neighborhood associations about and what level of authority do you want to give the neighborhood associations over do you want to restrict the number of construct open constructions that can happen in your neighborhood at a given point in time or do you not we're not trying to get we're not trying to implement but these are things that we can recommend that should be discussed with a subject matter expert that would then come into the township and give them advice construction permits so that 50 homes aren't be built at the same time and all those trucks come in all at the same time is that what you're suggesting okay i got it one issue that could muddle it is do you if you put a new roof on your house or do you are you going to ask for permitting things for that i think because that those trucks are just as robust and and actually one cracked my whole driveway putting up the shingle so we i think if this if you're going to make this like stick then i think you have to go anything above a certain weight that's coming into the subdivision that needs a permit there's going to be this secondary fee that you have to pay and i think the roofers have to get a permit um before they start bringing and stuff anyway but that material uh you know a guy bringing joyce in you know you're right because we have no new construction in our there there are no lots in our neighborhood everything's a renovation and this and that but the the um the roofing companies uh you know they're fine and they're welcome in but um so to take that concept to the where it really should be it's just the weight

  25. and give them advice construction permits so that 50 homes aren't be built at the same time and all those trucks come in all at the same time is that what you're suggesting okay i got it one issue that could muddle it is do you if you put a new roof on your house or do you are you going to ask for permitting things for that i think because that those trucks are just as robust and and actually one cracked my whole driveway putting up the shingle so we i think if this if you're going to make this like stick then i think you have to go anything above a certain weight that's coming into the subdivision that needs a permit there's going to be this secondary fee that you have to pay and i think the roofers have to get a permit um before they start bringing and stuff anyway but that material uh you know a guy bringing joyce in you know you're right because we have no new construction in our there there are no lots in our neighborhood everything's a renovation and this and that but the the um the roofing companies uh you know they're fine and they're welcome in but um so to take that concept to the where it really should be it's just the weight and in the aspect of of it's the circumstance right which everything is there so and that i think it would be i think again i think it would be an interesting concept to debate with the supervisors well i think Again, I think you need subject matter experts that have national exposure to understand where the goalposts should be on how you do that. Now, if you take it all the way to roof repairs and modifications, that could be. If you base it by the weight, then that's what it is. I replaced my roof a year ago. It was $55,000. I don't think I would have not done it if it was $55,000 plus 1%. $750, yeah, well, $750. Yeah. Yeah, that's the point. But anyway. A question. All right. Is the recommendation to say that based on that concentration and density that you'd only allow so many buildings to occur in that geographical location? The recommendation is that the township track where construction is happening and how long it takes, how long that construction site is an active construction site.

  26. they're welcome in but um so to take that concept to the where it really should be it's just the weight and in the aspect of of it's the circumstance right which everything is there so and that i think it would be i think again i think it would be an interesting concept to debate with the supervisors well i think Again, I think you need subject matter experts that have national exposure to understand where the goalposts should be on how you do that. Now, if you take it all the way to roof repairs and modifications, that could be. If you base it by the weight, then that's what it is. I replaced my roof a year ago. It was $55,000. I don't think I would have not done it if it was $55,000 plus 1%. $750, yeah, well, $750. Yeah. Yeah, that's the point. But anyway. A question. All right. Is the recommendation to say that based on that concentration and density that you'd only allow so many buildings to occur in that geographical location? The recommendation is that the township track where construction is happening and how long it takes, how long that construction site is an active construction site. What does that do for us? It gives us the ability to then talk to subject matter experts that should be able to advise the township trustees as to what do you want to do about that. You have, right now I have seven homes in my neighborhood that are under various stages of construction. From a hole just got dug for a new house to their... was it to people since the Councillor and Gr downside of the 여x in the area that have been dispensed throughout the years of the city? I never bothered by just going through that espionage thing. starting to put landscaping in. But how does that, the length of construction, how does that affect the damage done to the road when the same amount of dirt has come out, whether it takes two years or three weeks, how does that affect the damage to the roads, the length of construction? The length of construction in itself doesn't contribute to the damage. It doesn't add to the damage to the road. But the length of construction then means that instead of one house in your neighborhood being under construction, like now I have seven. But it's still the same amount of damage, each one. It's creating the same amount of damage. But the density is now confined to five city blocks.

  27. The recommendation is that the township track where construction is happening and how long it takes, how long that construction site is an active construction site. What does that do for us? It gives us the ability to then talk to subject matter experts that should be able to advise the township trustees as to what do you want to do about that. You have, right now I have seven homes in my neighborhood that are under various stages of construction. From a hole just got dug for a new house to their... was it to people since the Councillor and Gr downside of the 여x in the area that have been dispensed throughout the years of the city? I never bothered by just going through that espionage thing. starting to put landscaping in. But how does that, the length of construction, how does that affect the damage done to the road when the same amount of dirt has come out, whether it takes two years or three weeks, how does that affect the damage to the roads, the length of construction? The length of construction in itself doesn't contribute to the damage. It doesn't add to the damage to the road. But the length of construction then means that instead of one house in your neighborhood being under construction, like now I have seven. But it's still the same amount of damage, each one. It's creating the same amount of damage. But the density is now confined to five city blocks. It's not spread out over. If that doesn't worsen the roads, and you've got seven homes plodding into the pool for that subdivision. So that is the pool to draw from down the road in the future. And we're not suggesting to limit that. All we're suggesting is that to tell, to report, and only report that you issued 50, making up a number, X number of new house permits in a given year, is an irrelevant piece of data, or it's an incomplete piece of data, if you're really trying to look at the whole process. would you want to add to that? Yes, but what recommendations would you have to say or could that person reasonably make? I mean, they couldn't say cut off permits for that subdivision. I mean, I don't see the trustees do that. I'm not a subject matter expert, so I don't know what a subject matter expert would recommend to the township to do. But if I were a subject matter expert on this topic, I would want to see that data. I can see the order of magnitude if you have a whole bunch of house coming.

  28. But the density is now confined to five city blocks. It's not spread out over. If that doesn't worsen the roads, and you've got seven homes plodding into the pool for that subdivision. So that is the pool to draw from down the road in the future. And we're not suggesting to limit that. All we're suggesting is that to tell, to report, and only report that you issued 50, making up a number, X number of new house permits in a given year, is an irrelevant piece of data, or it's an incomplete piece of data, if you're really trying to look at the whole process. would you want to add to that? Yes, but what recommendations would you have to say or could that person reasonably make? I mean, they couldn't say cut off permits for that subdivision. I mean, I don't see the trustees do that. I'm not a subject matter expert, so I don't know what a subject matter expert would recommend to the township to do. But if I were a subject matter expert on this topic, I would want to see that data. I can see the order of magnitude if you have a whole bunch of house coming. But on the other hand, a builder's point of view, depending on the economy, some builders would start a home but would not finish for two or three years if the market is down and they're not able to sell it. And so it can prolong. You know, they don't have maybe very little activity. The building permit requires them to do something every, you know, in one year. Like, you know, I'm telling you from the experience, my home was rebuilt. And because of the COVID and all that, the guy continued to, it took three or four years to actually build it because there was no market. So, you know, it's a tough one to tell a builder, you know, that you... So all you're saying is just... Track the data. Contribute... Track the data. nakita is not guaranteed, but then what...? But then... you do with it you ask a subject matter expert to answer that question no subject matter expert like what i'm just i'm an engineer because i mean if somebody asked if somebody asked me you know what are you going to do to design this new car i want to see a whole bunch of data from from what you

  29. But on the other hand, a builder's point of view, depending on the economy, some builders would start a home but would not finish for two or three years if the market is down and they're not able to sell it. And so it can prolong. You know, they don't have maybe very little activity. The building permit requires them to do something every, you know, in one year. Like, you know, I'm telling you from the experience, my home was rebuilt. And because of the COVID and all that, the guy continued to, it took three or four years to actually build it because there was no market. So, you know, it's a tough one to tell a builder, you know, that you... So all you're saying is just... Track the data. Contribute... Track the data. nakita is not guaranteed, but then what...? But then... you do with it you ask a subject matter expert to answer that question no subject matter expert like what i'm just i'm an engineer because i mean if somebody asked if somebody asked me you know what are you going to do to design this new car i want to see a whole bunch of data from from what you did from the ground up um i i i'm i'm confident that there are subject urban urban subject matter experts out there that do this kind of work so i think understanding how much construction is going on in our township at any given point in time is not a function of how many permits you issued it's how many how many open construction projects are going on over a period of time now maybe a subject matter expert looks at that and says yeah i don't think you need to do anything about it but it's data and in the world that we're moving into in the future with ai you can't possibly have enough data to satisfy yourself so for for example if the subject matter expert looks at this data and then what what would he he said oh there are too many homes then then what do you you can't stop people from legally correct legally you can't stop people from he can't the subject matter expert can't do anything all he can do is make recommendations to the township trustees what i'm saying is for example in your subdivision

  30. are you going to do to design this new car i want to see a whole bunch of data from from what you did from the ground up um i i i'm i'm confident that there are subject urban urban subject matter experts out there that do this kind of work so i think understanding how much construction is going on in our township at any given point in time is not a function of how many permits you issued it's how many how many open construction projects are going on over a period of time now maybe a subject matter expert looks at that and says yeah i don't think you need to do anything about it but it's data and in the world that we're moving into in the future with ai you can't possibly have enough data to satisfy yourself so for for example if the subject matter expert looks at this data and then what what would he he said oh there are too many homes then then what do you you can't stop people from legally correct legally you can't stop people from he can't the subject matter expert can't do anything all he can do is make recommendations to the township trustees what i'm saying is for example in your subdivision Asia, instead of three homes, there are 10 homes being rebuilt, and there are too many in our point of view, but you can't, subject matter expert says, somebody like me says, oh yeah, there are too many for this small area, but you can't tell them that you cannot build now because, for whatever reason, you can't stop them, right? Yeah, but what I hear is that you're taking a concept of a piece of data that we're recommending that we should collect, and you're extrapolating it to some negative impact, some negative result that somebody might do with it later. We don't know what somebody's going to do with it later, and we're not trying to tell people what they're doing with it later, but I can tell you that I think that if, you know, you said that in your subdivision you had this deed restriction that was lifted, maybe in a different neighborhood, maybe they would want, maybe the HOA in the neighborhood with the approval of people, maybe they would want to restrict the number of homes. Well, that's up to them to do that, and that's a legal document, an agreement, a contract,

  31. Asia, instead of three homes, there are 10 homes being rebuilt, and there are too many in our point of view, but you can't, subject matter expert says, somebody like me says, oh yeah, there are too many for this small area, but you can't tell them that you cannot build now because, for whatever reason, you can't stop them, right? Yeah, but what I hear is that you're taking a concept of a piece of data that we're recommending that we should collect, and you're extrapolating it to some negative impact, some negative result that somebody might do with it later. We don't know what somebody's going to do with it later, and we're not trying to tell people what they're doing with it later, but I can tell you that I think that if, you know, you said that in your subdivision you had this deed restriction that was lifted, maybe in a different neighborhood, maybe they would want, maybe the HOA in the neighborhood with the approval of people, maybe they would want to restrict the number of homes. Well, that's up to them to do that, and that's a legal document, an agreement, a contract, basically. And we're not, we're not trying to, we're not trying to impact that, we're not suggesting that we should be trying to impact that, we're just saying collect as much data as you can. And I would go out on a limb. to say that i i i would be willing to bet that the method of permitting that the township uses hasn't changed in 40 or 50 years maybe the amount of the permits have gone up with inflation but the methodology probably hasn't changed and the type of data that we're suggesting can only make the township smarter and make it more appealing to the future because then we know what's going on and yeah it i'd feel a lot better about construction in my neighborhood if i knew that the seven homes in my neighborhood that are currently under construction between them they're going to contribute you know a million dollars toward road construction in my neighborhood build away you know but we don't know what i do know is is that when i looked at the data that said you know 47 permits were issued in 2025 and i know that seven of those homes were in my neighborhood

  32. Well, that's up to them to do that, and that's a legal document, an agreement, a contract, basically. And we're not, we're not trying to, we're not trying to impact that, we're not suggesting that we should be trying to impact that, we're just saying collect as much data as you can. And I would go out on a limb. to say that i i i would be willing to bet that the method of permitting that the township uses hasn't changed in 40 or 50 years maybe the amount of the permits have gone up with inflation but the methodology probably hasn't changed and the type of data that we're suggesting can only make the township smarter and make it more appealing to the future because then we know what's going on and yeah it i'd feel a lot better about construction in my neighborhood if i knew that the seven homes in my neighborhood that are currently under construction between them they're going to contribute you know a million dollars toward road construction in my neighborhood build away you know but we don't know what i do know is is that when i looked at the data that said you know 47 permits were issued in 2025 and i know that seven of those homes were in my neighborhood and they're still under construction it's an it's it's a level of impact that happens to a to a neighborhood i don't disagree i think you you're right but what is the end result after you track all that and then subject matter let's say i'm a licensed engineer i say there are too many in your your neighborhood but i don't know whether we can restrict I don't know that we can and that's not what we're trying to say but you know what the point is that the exercise here the assignment was to come up with recommendations yeah and I think that as far as I'm concerned the recommendation to look look at some sort of a fee added to new construction to go into a fund I think that's a good subject I like that I'm just gonna give my opinions of these their own and there's nothing wrong with collecting data it doesn't hurt anybody it doesn't it doesn't cost it well cost to do it but it's there's never a downside to having more information than less and so I a recommendation to collect data and format it to look at the permitting how it's

  33. you know 47 permits were issued in 2025 and i know that seven of those homes were in my neighborhood and they're still under construction it's an it's it's a level of impact that happens to a to a neighborhood i don't disagree i think you you're right but what is the end result after you track all that and then subject matter let's say i'm a licensed engineer i say there are too many in your your neighborhood but i don't know whether we can restrict I don't know that we can and that's not what we're trying to say but you know what the point is that the exercise here the assignment was to come up with recommendations yeah and I think that as far as I'm concerned the recommendation to look look at some sort of a fee added to new construction to go into a fund I think that's a good subject I like that I'm just gonna give my opinions of these their own and there's nothing wrong with collecting data it doesn't hurt anybody it doesn't it doesn't cost it well cost to do it but it's there's never a downside to having more information than less and so I a recommendation to collect data and format it to look at the permitting how it's done I don't see a problem with recommending that because it's there's no I don't see a downside to more information no I don't think so either and what Fred's getting at I think we're thinking like in a short period of time if you go back to Fred's neighborhood or Westchester village ten years ago when this all started and we've been collecting money at that time yeah I mean that's the whole point that's right that's the whole point you know and we're debating about how we would implement this I think we I think we should just we should just sit back and say this is a recommendation how it gets done is not going to be decided by the people here I get some math exactly if there's a home for a million and a half that's fifteen thousand dollars at the one percent suggestion. After seven years, that $15,000 at 5% is just over $20,000. So if we use the seven in your neighborhood, just assumptions, the seven homes times 20 after only seven years, that's $140,000 that is available for your subdivision for future SAD. You know, it's a stir. But you have to remember that that goes up, yes. It went up from $15,000 to $20,000, whatever. Well, I understand. But the cost went up even more. I understand. So it's something. It's money. But that's $140,000 you didn't have. Yeah, right. I guess that's. The real problem you have is what if we don't have to spend it in only seven years? What if you don't have to spend it? Well, the assumption is you do because it destroys our homes. Well, the assumption is what if they did such a great job

  34. recommendation to collect data and format it to look at the permitting how it's done I don't see a problem with recommending that because it's there's no I don't see a downside to more information no I don't think so either and what Fred's getting at I think we're thinking like in a short period of time if you go back to Fred's neighborhood or Westchester village ten years ago when this all started and we've been collecting money at that time yeah I mean that's the whole point that's right that's the whole point you know and we're debating about how we would implement this I think we I think we should just we should just sit back and say this is a recommendation how it gets done is not going to be decided by the people here I get some math exactly if there's a home for a million and a half that's fifteen thousand dollars at the one percent suggestion. After seven years, that $15,000 at 5% is just over $20,000. So if we use the seven in your neighborhood, just assumptions, the seven homes times 20 after only seven years, that's $140,000 that is available for your subdivision for future SAD. You know, it's a stir. But you have to remember that that goes up, yes. It went up from $15,000 to $20,000, whatever. Well, I understand. But the cost went up even more. I understand. So it's something. It's money. But that's $140,000 you didn't have. Yeah, right. I guess that's. The real problem you have is what if we don't have to spend it in only seven years? What if you don't have to spend it? Well, the assumption is you do because it destroys our homes. Well, the assumption is what if they did such a great job job on the road, that they don't, they don't deteriorate- Well, that's what I asked you before if they don't do it, but let's assume they will, for this recommendation. Well, we have to- I think they're assuming they will, that's what we have to address. One other quick question. Is the recommendation assumes or implies that these construction trucks are causing the damage to the roads? Yeah. In order to make that premise, do we have any facts to back it up? So that, because that then leads us to the fee. So how do we, how do we say we are confident that this fee is necessary because of? Yeah, I didn't. Yeah. ... think you can answer that first and then yeah i don't think you have to tie it to a specific piece of science because you're going to get a lot of pushback from from the road commission who want to protect their own position because if they admit that this that these types of trucks

  35. You know, it's a stir. But you have to remember that that goes up, yes. It went up from $15,000 to $20,000, whatever. Well, I understand. But the cost went up even more. I understand. So it's something. It's money. But that's $140,000 you didn't have. Yeah, right. I guess that's. The real problem you have is what if we don't have to spend it in only seven years? What if you don't have to spend it? Well, the assumption is you do because it destroys our homes. Well, the assumption is what if they did such a great job job on the road, that they don't, they don't deteriorate- Well, that's what I asked you before if they don't do it, but let's assume they will, for this recommendation. Well, we have to- I think they're assuming they will, that's what we have to address. One other quick question. Is the recommendation assumes or implies that these construction trucks are causing the damage to the roads? Yeah. In order to make that premise, do we have any facts to back it up? So that, because that then leads us to the fee. So how do we, how do we say we are confident that this fee is necessary because of? Yeah, I didn't. Yeah. ... think you can answer that first and then yeah i don't think you have to tie it to a specific piece of science because you're going to get a lot of pushback from from the road commission who want to protect their own position because if they admit that this that these types of trucks capable of causing damage then they have to they're they're implying the fact that they under engineered the roads and their lawyers aren't going to let them do that so we're not trying to say that you know that that there's there's definite proof that says this is causing the impact and that that's why we should raise the amount of money we should raise the amount of money because of the fact that we're building bigger homes the township is growing and there is damage being done to the roads and we don't have the money to fix them period now the reason why we should restrict the certain types of trucks from being on the roads that comes down to we don't need to have these tandem tandem trailer trucks on non-cut-through roads you know and that should be something that the township wants to recommend to the road commission that we that we we get a forbearance from the road commission to not allow um now the builders still got to move a million pounds worth

  36. want to protect their own position because if they admit that this that these types of trucks capable of causing damage then they have to they're they're implying the fact that they under engineered the roads and their lawyers aren't going to let them do that so we're not trying to say that you know that that there's there's definite proof that says this is causing the impact and that that's why we should raise the amount of money we should raise the amount of money because of the fact that we're building bigger homes the township is growing and there is damage being done to the roads and we don't have the money to fix them period now the reason why we should restrict the certain types of trucks from being on the roads that comes down to we don't need to have these tandem tandem trailer trucks on non-cut-through roads you know and that should be something that the township wants to recommend to the road commission that we that we we get a forbearance from the road commission to not allow um now the builders still got to move a million pounds worth dirt they're going to move it with more trucks they'll figure it out you know they'll figure it out um gary i could be wrong i could be wrong that's never happened no but one of the people one of the people who presented to us made that specific statement that the heavier the truck load the more damage there is to the road and somebody said that so it's not it's not a a hallucinatory concept well there are certain states that don't allow the truck right well and that's exactly so so the point is it's the weight of the to me it's the weight of the truck it's not what it's hauling and the frequency of of the use on there and it is some and i don't know if the it was the rco but anyway it doesn't matter who's a a learned person told us that so we could just go with that and just say that's you tell us what the what the what the limit is yeah i think the uh just just to clarify the the way the regulations are that it is for axle 80 per axle wing yeah so if you just have two axle there's a lot more concentrated load compared to the 18 wheeler

  37. dirt they're going to move it with more trucks they'll figure it out you know they'll figure it out um gary i could be wrong i could be wrong that's never happened no but one of the people one of the people who presented to us made that specific statement that the heavier the truck load the more damage there is to the road and somebody said that so it's not it's not a a hallucinatory concept well there are certain states that don't allow the truck right well and that's exactly so so the point is it's the weight of the to me it's the weight of the truck it's not what it's hauling and the frequency of of the use on there and it is some and i don't know if the it was the rco but anyway it doesn't matter who's a a learned person told us that so we could just go with that and just say that's you tell us what the what the what the limit is yeah i think the uh just just to clarify the the way the regulations are that it is for axle 80 per axle wing yeah so if you just have two axle there's a lot more concentrated load compared to the 18 wheeler kind of thing so but i agree with you uh let's not go into detail just yeah that command what is what is what it is you know that that limit that you're talking about you've got to remember one thing that the roads in those subdivisions That are coming apart that we need to talk about and what they're saying these these large trucks in the construction damaging They're 80 year old roads They are old subdivisions those roads were never built to the standards today They were never built to have this kind of weights and limits and and that was by law the regulations the specifications back then were way lower way lower and less Effective as they are than they are today. So first of all, I don't think that if we recommend That we that something to be done about the weight and that I don't think that our COC can come back and say well Then you're telling us we're doing we didn't spec them right because we have to say 80 years ago 70 years ago That's all that's a whole nother thing, you know, and we can it rose today are under way higher Specifications even yours in your subdivision when they built it or in Bloomfield village Those roads are way higher specs than they were back when they were built when when Johnson Bradway built that something we can even admit The fact that the roads are at are well beyond the end of their design life

  38. if you just have two axle there's a lot more concentrated load compared to the 18 wheeler kind of thing so but i agree with you uh let's not go into detail just yeah that command what is what is what it is you know that that limit that you're talking about you've got to remember one thing that the roads in those subdivisions That are coming apart that we need to talk about and what they're saying these these large trucks in the construction damaging They're 80 year old roads They are old subdivisions those roads were never built to the standards today They were never built to have this kind of weights and limits and and that was by law the regulations the specifications back then were way lower way lower and less Effective as they are than they are today. So first of all, I don't think that if we recommend That we that something to be done about the weight and that I don't think that our COC can come back and say well Then you're telling us we're doing we didn't spec them right because we have to say 80 years ago 70 years ago That's all that's a whole nother thing, you know, and we can it rose today are under way higher Specifications even yours in your subdivision when they built it or in Bloomfield village Those roads are way higher specs than they were back when they were built when when Johnson Bradway built that something we can even admit The fact that the roads are at are well beyond the end of their design life the reality is is that putting heavy vehicles on them Only makes it only accelerates the damage So, you know and and there's nobody with a weight scale you know like Nobody showed up with a weight scale to measure it the weight of any of the trucks that that were were hauling materials in or out of my subdivision Now Road Commission said they have a way master and if the township calls and says we want you to show up and weigh and check weights on vehicles at this particular time they will do it but the township has right but the township has to call they can't pick a sewer drain but they can come and wait they can well i was telling you is that there's a there's there's there's a process in place i've talked about that too right there's a process in place and and now i don't know maybe the township has the authority to tell builders that they have to self-certify for weight limits again i'm not a subject matter expert in this area but i think that i think that because because we're still

  39. The fact that the roads are at are well beyond the end of their design life the reality is is that putting heavy vehicles on them Only makes it only accelerates the damage So, you know and and there's nobody with a weight scale you know like Nobody showed up with a weight scale to measure it the weight of any of the trucks that that were were hauling materials in or out of my subdivision Now Road Commission said they have a way master and if the township calls and says we want you to show up and weigh and check weights on vehicles at this particular time they will do it but the township has right but the township has to call they can't pick a sewer drain but they can come and wait they can well i was telling you is that there's a there's there's there's a process in place i've talked about that too right there's a process in place and and now i don't know maybe the township has the authority to tell builders that they have to self-certify for weight limits again i'm not a subject matter expert in this area but i think that i think that because because we're still living in a township that was that started to mature such a long time ago and we're rebuilding under a whole new economy i think we need smart people to tell us what we should be doing going forward and i think we're missing an opportunity if we don't collect the hacks one suggestion on the weight thing instead of telling in the report the recommendation is to limit the weight why don't we ask say the recommendation just a suggestion the recommendation is to study what the weight limit weights do to these roads and then make them and then figure out if we need to change the regulation in other words don't tell them what to do, don't tell them we have to change them, but have somebody, an official you've talked about, and somebody who knows what they're talking about, what if we just direct the township to institute a study to find out if, in fact, the weights of these trucks more than garbage trucks, for instance, are actually damaging the roads? Sure. I mean, I think that solves everything as well. It's just you've got to start the ball rolling in a direction. Yeah, it's going to snowball. Your area, you know what's going to happen.

  40. subject matter expert in this area but i think that i think that because because we're still living in a township that was that started to mature such a long time ago and we're rebuilding under a whole new economy i think we need smart people to tell us what we should be doing going forward and i think we're missing an opportunity if we don't collect the hacks one suggestion on the weight thing instead of telling in the report the recommendation is to limit the weight why don't we ask say the recommendation just a suggestion the recommendation is to study what the weight limit weights do to these roads and then make them and then figure out if we need to change the regulation in other words don't tell them what to do, don't tell them we have to change them, but have somebody, an official you've talked about, and somebody who knows what they're talking about, what if we just direct the township to institute a study to find out if, in fact, the weights of these trucks more than garbage trucks, for instance, are actually damaging the roads? Sure. I mean, I think that solves everything as well. It's just you've got to start the ball rolling in a direction. Yeah, it's going to snowball. Your area, you know what's going to happen. People are just going to build and build and build. They are now, yeah. Right, it's just going to, so if we don't, we're not going to stop that, but if we can come up with a process to catch it as it's going, it will help us, and we won't find ourselves in the same situation that we are in. I just want to get to the point where we can actually give them the report. I think we have enough. We're hung up on the details. I think it's a matter of what we're doing today is out of date. I think we made our sentiments, we can make our sentiments known, and then we're going to have a subcommittee that's going to have to put together the PowerPoint and get the presentation in a presentation form. Okay. So if we take that subject and take these, and we can, based on our discussion, here today yeah use that you're and then boil it down and put it in the proper format okay do we need to talk we did talk about it brought it up some of the

  41. Your area, you know what's going to happen. People are just going to build and build and build. They are now, yeah. Right, it's just going to, so if we don't, we're not going to stop that, but if we can come up with a process to catch it as it's going, it will help us, and we won't find ourselves in the same situation that we are in. I just want to get to the point where we can actually give them the report. I think we have enough. We're hung up on the details. I think it's a matter of what we're doing today is out of date. I think we made our sentiments, we can make our sentiments known, and then we're going to have a subcommittee that's going to have to put together the PowerPoint and get the presentation in a presentation form. Okay. So if we take that subject and take these, and we can, based on our discussion, here today yeah use that you're and then boil it down and put it in the proper format okay do we need to talk we did talk about it brought it up some of the matters of fact in here that that we're not gonna we're not gonna present that again right we're just gonna boil it down take that out okay that's good yeah I think that's good yeah I got it the whole purpose of this and Mindy and I can go through it and clean it up a little bit more but I think that we're from my perspective I think what we had discussed before was we're gonna do two things we're gonna make a recommendation to the board or to the trustees on the things that we should do and then separately we're gonna give them documents that supported where those recommendations what was the basis for those recommendations something like this becomes a supporting document that they can review and ask us questions on and and and and create a dialogue back and forth but the recommendation is very simple then within the committee the subcommittee is going to come up with the format a draft format of what the presentation and then you will each have an opportunity to take a look at it and say no that's that's no good you got to do this well yeah that's great is that okay the only thing I'm going to ask I'm gonna say though is if what you put in both well in both of these

  42. format okay do we need to talk we did talk about it brought it up some of the matters of fact in here that that we're not gonna we're not gonna present that again right we're just gonna boil it down take that out okay that's good yeah I think that's good yeah I got it the whole purpose of this and Mindy and I can go through it and clean it up a little bit more but I think that we're from my perspective I think what we had discussed before was we're gonna do two things we're gonna make a recommendation to the board or to the trustees on the things that we should do and then separately we're gonna give them documents that supported where those recommendations what was the basis for those recommendations something like this becomes a supporting document that they can review and ask us questions on and and and and create a dialogue back and forth but the recommendation is very simple then within the committee the subcommittee is going to come up with the format a draft format of what the presentation and then you will each have an opportunity to take a look at it and say no that's that's no good you got to do this well yeah that's great is that okay the only thing I'm going to ask I'm gonna say though is if what you put in both well in both of these I have two of them this is the other one what's in here some of it I I don't think even in a supporting document should be in there it's my point okay just a supporting document the recommendation I agree I got it but in in the supporting documents there's some some articles in here some things here that are not factually I don't think are factually correct so okay but and and in fact I sent both of you I sent you that email and you can look and you see what I'm thinking maybe others I don't know that's what I thought okay okay anybody else okay okay thanks that that was a good discussion I think all right so I guess I just have one other question Mike just talked we've gone through this sort of ad nauseum you know what we might be able to recommend as as the township supervisor are those recommendations that you think that would be a conflict with the other trustees in what way in not wanting to implement any of it I don't think that's fair I mean there's each person has their own I don't think it's

  43. I have two of them this is the other one what's in here some of it I I don't think even in a supporting document should be in there it's my point okay just a supporting document the recommendation I agree I got it but in in the supporting documents there's some some articles in here some things here that are not factually I don't think are factually correct so okay but and and in fact I sent both of you I sent you that email and you can look and you see what I'm thinking maybe others I don't know that's what I thought okay okay anybody else okay okay thanks that that was a good discussion I think all right so I guess I just have one other question Mike just talked we've gone through this sort of ad nauseum you know what we might be able to recommend as as the township supervisor are those recommendations that you think that would be a conflict with the other trustees in what way in not wanting to implement any of it I don't think that's fair I mean there's each person has their own I don't think it's fair to ask him to speak for all for all the trustees just like I don't think it would be fair to ask Jeff to speak for all of us ask him to speak for the trustees I'm just asking I would I could be an advocate for these issues because I think there's some real merit there and let's see what they decide because we spent over a year of our time and thank you all for volunteering for this and we've really gone down some different roads to discuss it but we've been I think it's been a great communication tool to the residents because when they call and complain about their roads what are we doing about it I send them the link to these meetings watch and we've had great discussions and about why and how we're in the situation so I think the trustees will be open to anything and everything because it's a very difficult subject for us and as Mindy stated the cost that our residents are bearing are somewhat it's very difficult yeah all right so even if even though let's just say even if some of the trustees would say you're crazy you we're not gonna do this that's not up to us to figure out ours is to tell it just to give them the suggestion if you don't like it that's great but this is what we come up this

  44. think that's fair I mean there's each person has their own I don't think it's fair to ask him to speak for all for all the trustees just like I don't think it would be fair to ask Jeff to speak for all of us ask him to speak for the trustees I'm just asking I would I could be an advocate for these issues because I think there's some real merit there and let's see what they decide because we spent over a year of our time and thank you all for volunteering for this and we've really gone down some different roads to discuss it but we've been I think it's been a great communication tool to the residents because when they call and complain about their roads what are we doing about it I send them the link to these meetings watch and we've had great discussions and about why and how we're in the situation so I think the trustees will be open to anything and everything because it's a very difficult subject for us and as Mindy stated the cost that our residents are bearing are somewhat it's very difficult yeah all right so even if even though let's just say even if some of the trustees would say you're crazy you we're not gonna do this that's not up to us to figure out ours is to tell it just to give them the suggestion if you don't like it that's great but this is what we come up this is our recommendations but had we done what Fred and Mindy are proposing 10 years ago when this building boom started I don't know what year it was could you imagine how much easier it would be for these SEDs for people in these neighborhoods oh yeah well I mean I mean in my neighborhood alone you know we have basically I think all the lots are right around one acre if you go back 10 years ago those lots were basically Costing, once they were cleaned out, they were basically costing about $350,000. Today, those same lots, one just sold three months ago for $650,000. The lot. Well, you know, we have, in Westchester, we have about 20%, give it, it's close, about 20% of the homes have been knocked down and new ones built. Out of 461 homes. Yeah. You know, so, so is that, you know, that's 80 homes, what is it, 80, what's it, 20%? Yeah. So, so, big numbers. You think, like you said, if you had on 80 homes and you had between then and now, $10,000 to $20,000, $15,000, because they are going now for close to $3 million bucks.

  45. suggestion if you don't like it that's great but this is what we come up this is our recommendations but had we done what Fred and Mindy are proposing 10 years ago when this building boom started I don't know what year it was could you imagine how much easier it would be for these SEDs for people in these neighborhoods oh yeah well I mean I mean in my neighborhood alone you know we have basically I think all the lots are right around one acre if you go back 10 years ago those lots were basically Costing, once they were cleaned out, they were basically costing about $350,000. Today, those same lots, one just sold three months ago for $650,000. The lot. Well, you know, we have, in Westchester, we have about 20%, give it, it's close, about 20% of the homes have been knocked down and new ones built. Out of 461 homes. Yeah. You know, so, so is that, you know, that's 80 homes, what is it, 80, what's it, 20%? Yeah. So, so, big numbers. You think, like you said, if you had on 80 homes and you had between then and now, $10,000 to $20,000, $15,000, because they are going now for close to $3 million bucks. Yeah. That's a significant amount of money that would knock down the SAD. Yeah, and that's what people are looking for. They're not looking, right? That's a, okay. Yeah, I think that if it's something that, it gives something, from my opinion, that the township, from the standpoint of the trustees, can sort of put a feather in their hat with the residents, that we are trying to offset some of the cost. And this is a method of doing it. And maybe you hire a subject matter expert, and then maybe they tell you 1% is not enough. I don't know. I don't know where the threshold of pain is. But the reality of life is, is that somebody will be able to tell you that number. What the economy bears. Of course. Yeah. Yeah. Of course. All right, the next item. I'm sorry. I think, at least for me, I think we've discussed this to the point where we can move on. Okay. I agree. That's what I was just going to get to. The next item, the thing I want to do is, I want to, let's figure out with, Scoop, it's only five o'clock so we have time, but I want to figure out when we can present this to the board. Oh geez. So we need to set a deadline. We do, but the problem is that we're getting into the summer and people go on vacation, etc.

  46. $10,000 to $20,000, $15,000, because they are going now for close to $3 million bucks. Yeah. That's a significant amount of money that would knock down the SAD. Yeah, and that's what people are looking for. They're not looking, right? That's a, okay. Yeah, I think that if it's something that, it gives something, from my opinion, that the township, from the standpoint of the trustees, can sort of put a feather in their hat with the residents, that we are trying to offset some of the cost. And this is a method of doing it. And maybe you hire a subject matter expert, and then maybe they tell you 1% is not enough. I don't know. I don't know where the threshold of pain is. But the reality of life is, is that somebody will be able to tell you that number. What the economy bears. Of course. Yeah. Yeah. Of course. All right, the next item. I'm sorry. I think, at least for me, I think we've discussed this to the point where we can move on. Okay. I agree. That's what I was just going to get to. The next item, the thing I want to do is, I want to, let's figure out with, Scoop, it's only five o'clock so we have time, but I want to figure out when we can present this to the board. Oh geez. So we need to set a deadline. We do, but the problem is that we're getting into the summer and people go on vacation, etc. So do you want to, we could, I'm going to throw this out, not advocating anything. Do we want to schedule time over the summer or do you want to say let's wait till September when everybody's back? I'm just throwing it out. You decide. You tell me what you think. I think after Labor Day would be a good time to do it, right? One way to look at it is I think we need at least two more meetings to finalize. I could see a draft report from the subject that you're talking about. We come back, discuss it, then they go back and finalize. So you got to figure out in this timeframe what we will be done. Because we can't force it into the, you know, because of calendars. It's okay, we got two meetings. When are we going to do those? And then when would we be ready? And then you can look at the calendar for the board. So you don't want, you're saying don't set a date now. Well, I think we should set a date today is when we're going to meet to finish this. Well, that's just a regular meeting. Yeah. Okay. I got it. Okay. Jeff's thought our next meeting is July 22nd because of holidays and then the meeting the meeting after that is August 22nd so yeah I don't know what I know it's the first I think it was the one before the next week is or the week

  47. problem is that we're getting into the summer and people go on vacation, etc. So do you want to, we could, I'm going to throw this out, not advocating anything. Do we want to schedule time over the summer or do you want to say let's wait till September when everybody's back? I'm just throwing it out. You decide. You tell me what you think. I think after Labor Day would be a good time to do it, right? One way to look at it is I think we need at least two more meetings to finalize. I could see a draft report from the subject that you're talking about. We come back, discuss it, then they go back and finalize. So you got to figure out in this timeframe what we will be done. Because we can't force it into the, you know, because of calendars. It's okay, we got two meetings. When are we going to do those? And then when would we be ready? And then you can look at the calendar for the board. So you don't want, you're saying don't set a date now. Well, I think we should set a date today is when we're going to meet to finish this. Well, that's just a regular meeting. Yeah. Okay. I got it. Okay. Jeff's thought our next meeting is July 22nd because of holidays and then the meeting the meeting after that is August 22nd so yeah I don't know what I know it's the first I think it was the one before the next week is or the week after is holiday time and so that's why the 22nd I don't know why the meeting the election the primary yeah okay there you have it when's the primary it's one day you can vote now I get sports I thought somebody voted for me but someone did twice here's a question looking so so that's what it is we meet on the 15th July July that gets us around the holiday and then and then the 22nd yes so we could just do back-to-back and our our drafting is done we're finalized and what was the next meeting what you said July July 15 yeah that we just talked and then July 22nd back-to-back back-to-back okay or you can find find me now at that time

  48. it's the first I think it was the one before the next week is or the week after is holiday time and so that's why the 22nd I don't know why the meeting the election the primary yeah okay there you have it when's the primary it's one day you can vote now I get sports I thought somebody voted for me but someone did twice here's a question looking so so that's what it is we meet on the 15th July July that gets us around the holiday and then and then the 22nd yes so we could just do back-to-back and our our drafting is done we're finalized and what was the next meeting what you said July July 15 yeah that we just talked and then July 22nd back-to-back back-to-back okay or you can find find me now at that time Or you could move it out. July 15. And we'll confirm tomorrow sometime soon. Yeah. Okay, that's two more meetings, that's what you said. That's the right, Jeff? Yeah, okay, I'm here. I am here. And in the meantime, then the subcommittee's gonna have to start working right away. I'm leaving the next day. That's good. Is that gonna be the usual 430 to 6? Or the 430? I will come in time. 530 is what I'm saying. 4 to 530. I won't let them put me on a plane. All right. Why can't we schedule 4 to 530 in doing this, like this? Okay, but you're here on the 15th. Like we did today. Yeah. And if we go shorter, fine. Like, we're not gonna go to 530. Well, that's what I'm asking. So it's 4 to 530? 4 to 530. Okay, good. That gives us time to discuss without getting pressured into it. Sure. All of a sudden, we gotta leave. All right. July, so July 15th and July 22nd, for now. I'll confirm that tomorrow, looks like no interview. Yeah. Okay. What, what, Sue, I'm sorry, what'd you say? July 15th and 22nd. She'll confirm it tomorrow. Okay. Based on the commission. And then we're finished? Well. Except we, except we have to present to the final registration. No, no, but I'm saying we're not going to do, I thought, I thought we're going to do July

  49. Or you could move it out. July 15. And we'll confirm tomorrow sometime soon. Yeah. Okay, that's two more meetings, that's what you said. That's the right, Jeff? Yeah, okay, I'm here. I am here. And in the meantime, then the subcommittee's gonna have to start working right away. I'm leaving the next day. That's good. Is that gonna be the usual 430 to 6? Or the 430? I will come in time. 530 is what I'm saying. 4 to 530. I won't let them put me on a plane. All right. Why can't we schedule 4 to 530 in doing this, like this? Okay, but you're here on the 15th. Like we did today. Yeah. And if we go shorter, fine. Like, we're not gonna go to 530. Well, that's what I'm asking. So it's 4 to 530? 4 to 530. Okay, good. That gives us time to discuss without getting pressured into it. Sure. All of a sudden, we gotta leave. All right. July, so July 15th and July 22nd, for now. I'll confirm that tomorrow, looks like no interview. Yeah. Okay. What, what, Sue, I'm sorry, what'd you say? July 15th and 22nd. She'll confirm it tomorrow. Okay. Based on the commission. And then we're finished? Well. Except we, except we have to present to the final registration. No, no, but I'm saying we're not going to do, I thought, I thought we're going to do July and August. We're not. We're going to try to. Do July. August is out. August is out. Oh, it is? I didn't catch that. For now. For now. For now. We can always schedule. Oh, yeah, we can have another meeting in August. That's good for me because I'm going to be away too in August. I'm not meeting in August. Do we have to make... one-time recommendation to the trustees or can we make a recommendation and then come back at a later time and make additional recommendations yeah I mean I feel like I feel like getting something going even if it's just one topic or two topics is better than waiting three more months to get five topics present oh you mean you want it you want what you're saying is do something right now not not right now but I'm just saying is that let's let's try to get let's try to get something in front of the trustees as quickly as we can even if it doesn't embody all of the topics the subjects that we that we had discussed at the different levels in this minute may I ask a question of mr. McCready not what your board members would say or do but what are their expectations for our work when are they thinking I think they're just waiting because we had talked about giving a recommendation back in May and it got delayed but I think they're

  50. No, no, but I'm saying we're not going to do, I thought, I thought we're going to do July and August. We're not. We're going to try to. Do July. August is out. August is out. Oh, it is? I didn't catch that. For now. For now. For now. We can always schedule. Oh, yeah, we can have another meeting in August. That's good for me because I'm going to be away too in August. I'm not meeting in August. Do we have to make... one-time recommendation to the trustees or can we make a recommendation and then come back at a later time and make additional recommendations yeah I mean I feel like I feel like getting something going even if it's just one topic or two topics is better than waiting three more months to get five topics present oh you mean you want it you want what you're saying is do something right now not not right now but I'm just saying is that let's let's try to get let's try to get something in front of the trustees as quickly as we can even if it doesn't embody all of the topics the subjects that we that we had discussed at the different levels in this minute may I ask a question of mr. McCready not what your board members would say or do but what are their expectations for our work when are they thinking I think they're just waiting because we had talked about giving a recommendation back in May and it got delayed but I think they're waiting to hear they're just what is your advice and counsel about I think the schedule that we're setting right now will work okay and then I like Fred's idea after we make the recommendations we should reconvene because we'll hear trustees comments absolutely I would respectfully Fred I would disagree that we should get some couple of things I I think we should do as a package and do it as we said originally yes I get what you're saying but I think in my opinion and just one opinion we should wait until september like or probably then and or whenever and do one whole thing with all of the all the recommendations right that's what i think right and they may come back the trustees may come back and say can you clarify this for us and can you expand and look more into this area for us well if we want to come back that means that we have to keep this committee in going it's not dead once we make the recommendation then we can come back and do other things if that's what you want to do it's okay with me well we'll have to see yeah seriously i hope so too but i have no problem continuing on and following this up following up and right as they be making more recommendations and and monitoring as you go i don't have i have

  51. giving a recommendation back in May and it got delayed but I think they're waiting to hear they're just what is your advice and counsel about I think the schedule that we're setting right now will work okay and then I like Fred's idea after we make the recommendations we should reconvene because we'll hear trustees comments absolutely I would respectfully Fred I would disagree that we should get some couple of things I I think we should do as a package and do it as we said originally yes I get what you're saying but I think in my opinion and just one opinion we should wait until september like or probably then and or whenever and do one whole thing with all of the all the recommendations right that's what i think right and they may come back the trustees may come back and say can you clarify this for us and can you expand and look more into this area for us well if we want to come back that means that we have to keep this committee in going it's not dead once we make the recommendation then we can come back and do other things if that's what you want to do it's okay with me well we'll have to see yeah seriously i hope so too but i have no problem continuing on and following this up following up and right as they be making more recommendations and and monitoring as you go i don't have i have no problem making this permanent committee that meets twice you know regularly and discussing things we're coming up with solutions right remember the board of trustees established this as a real committee yeah was expecting to hear back from us and they didn't put any timelines in anything well it took it took longer we thought because it was so much more than we thought it's exactly right every time we got something we took two steps forward took a one step back because we found up something else i think we owe them something and we ought to put it together and say what we want to say and move on dot com and if they want more if they want more explanation if we have a nice opportunity to give them more explanation i want to give then we should take advantage of we're going to give them a complete thing but it doesn't take four months to do that right we're not talking about four months we're americans we can do things quicker than that yeah all right that's exactly 250 it's 250 come on all right anything that's not on the agenda anybody want to add anything all right so yeah go ahead sure absolutely come on up

  52. up and right as they be making more recommendations and and monitoring as you go i don't have i have no problem making this permanent committee that meets twice you know regularly and discussing things we're coming up with solutions right remember the board of trustees established this as a real committee yeah was expecting to hear back from us and they didn't put any timelines in anything well it took it took longer we thought because it was so much more than we thought it's exactly right every time we got something we took two steps forward took a one step back because we found up something else i think we owe them something and we ought to put it together and say what we want to say and move on dot com and if they want more if they want more explanation if we have a nice opportunity to give them more explanation i want to give then we should take advantage of we're going to give them a complete thing but it doesn't take four months to do that right we're not talking about four months we're americans we can do things quicker than that yeah all right that's exactly 250 it's 250 come on all right anything that's not on the agenda anybody want to add anything all right so yeah go ahead sure absolutely come on up don't worry about it just come on up you weren't you weren't the last one did you pay to get in we'll put that in the road so first a thought on the metrics i think um from my background you're finding out what the metrics are you can't measure anything unless you're you got the right metrics and so looking at that i think is a really good idea but what was going on in my mind on the fee you're getting tied up like a percent of what is it percent of the cost of the house percent of the what what i was thinking of is a percent of the change in assessed value that's which like then it becomes like it's public record you had a house now you've got a different house you had a lot now you've got a lot so you're not debating with the builder or the owner about how much is it worth it's the assessor's office that would determine that and then you you can come up with a what percent of that change in assessed value, and so that then could apply to a lot of different permit issues. The only problem with that is the assessment would have to come after it's built, not during it's built. My opinion would be that would be okay.

  53. don't worry about it just come on up you weren't you weren't the last one did you pay to get in we'll put that in the road so first a thought on the metrics i think um from my background you're finding out what the metrics are you can't measure anything unless you're you got the right metrics and so looking at that i think is a really good idea but what was going on in my mind on the fee you're getting tied up like a percent of what is it percent of the cost of the house percent of the what what i was thinking of is a percent of the change in assessed value that's which like then it becomes like it's public record you had a house now you've got a different house you had a lot now you've got a lot so you're not debating with the builder or the owner about how much is it worth it's the assessor's office that would determine that and then you you can come up with a what percent of that change in assessed value, and so that then could apply to a lot of different permit issues. The only problem with that is the assessment would have to come after it's built, not during it's built. My opinion would be that would be okay. But then the permits are issued before the assessment is, so it would be more difficult to collect the money. You have to find a way, I think. That's again, that's about implementation. I'm sorry. I broke the rule. I shouldn't have finished what you're saying. And then I thought it was great thinking about how heavy are the trucks and are you going to, is it for certain types of work? You know, some of these yard crew trucks that come rumbling through town are enormous, and they're probably heavier than some of the construction trucks that we see. So that could be another source, and someone mentioned the garbage trucks. Those things are huge. One piece of good news I would say, Mark and Wayne, you know, I've had a lot of issues with the road commission over the years, but we got a photo of one of those tandem trucks coming down North Williamsbury about a month ago. We had the number on the bumper, sent it to those guys, on it, on it. Not going to happen again. Because those trucks working in green are not supposed to be driving on the sections that were just completed. This is in Bloomfield Village. Yeah. That's what Clay's speaking of. That's right. No, it's working very well. There this car isteilish!

  54. My opinion would be that would be okay. But then the permits are issued before the assessment is, so it would be more difficult to collect the money. You have to find a way, I think. That's again, that's about implementation. I'm sorry. I broke the rule. I shouldn't have finished what you're saying. And then I thought it was great thinking about how heavy are the trucks and are you going to, is it for certain types of work? You know, some of these yard crew trucks that come rumbling through town are enormous, and they're probably heavier than some of the construction trucks that we see. So that could be another source, and someone mentioned the garbage trucks. Those things are huge. One piece of good news I would say, Mark and Wayne, you know, I've had a lot of issues with the road commission over the years, but we got a photo of one of those tandem trucks coming down North Williamsbury about a month ago. We had the number on the bumper, sent it to those guys, on it, on it. Not going to happen again. Because those trucks working in green are not supposed to be driving on the sections that were just completed. This is in Bloomfield Village. Yeah. That's what Clay's speaking of. That's right. No, it's working very well. There this car isteilish! is a road that has been redone in the same section. They were taking these big double-tandem trucks and coming down newly finished roads. So again, we caught them red-handed and the Road Commission jumped on it. And then just today, or over the weekend, walking around, again, a new area, we found several areas that have cement cracks on the new sidewalk and the new corner areas, sent those to Wayne and Mark, and within an hour, it's like, we're on it, you know, thanks for the input. But on the blog, for the yellow and gold section, they were very explicit in saying, if you see things that need to be done that weren't finished from last year or problems with what was done last year, let us know. So I'm just letting you know that they're helping. Great. Thanks. There's stuff that's gone around the cement. In some areas, it looks like it's already deteriorating and chipping and falling apart. And some of those trucks, we had one of the residents email us, and it was a truck, and it was there to fix some of the curbs and take the old ones out. And Mark ran over there, inspected the truck to make sure what was in the back of the dump

  55. is a road that has been redone in the same section. They were taking these big double-tandem trucks and coming down newly finished roads. So again, we caught them red-handed and the Road Commission jumped on it. And then just today, or over the weekend, walking around, again, a new area, we found several areas that have cement cracks on the new sidewalk and the new corner areas, sent those to Wayne and Mark, and within an hour, it's like, we're on it, you know, thanks for the input. But on the blog, for the yellow and gold section, they were very explicit in saying, if you see things that need to be done that weren't finished from last year or problems with what was done last year, let us know. So I'm just letting you know that they're helping. Great. Thanks. There's stuff that's gone around the cement. In some areas, it looks like it's already deteriorating and chipping and falling apart. And some of those trucks, we had one of the residents email us, and it was a truck, and it was there to fix some of the curbs and take the old ones out. And Mark ran over there, inspected the truck to make sure what was in the back of the dump truck. It was just a couple pieces of cement. And then asked them, you know, let's stay off these roads. But it was a, we're doing what we call a punch list right now. Yeah. And it's great to see the neighbors calling and protecting the road. I just love that. I think it's awesome. But I also informed the Village Police about it and asked them to help monitor it as well. Yeah, it's, um... This is Mark who works for the... Yeah, Mark Messler. Mark Messler. He works. He's our country. He's our country. He came over. He works for us. He works for us. Uh, us. So again, just a thought on some of the metrics and just to let you know that the team, the road commission people are being responsive, they're taking input. They've been very supportive. Not everything's going to get fixed, of course, and there's going to be other issues that pop up. I'm pleased if they're helping us. Thank you very much. You know, and I want to thank you for coming to these meetings. You've come to almost every one. And I thank you for that. And I'm glad to see you here. Well, I appreciate that. Thank you. You're a fan. I'm still working. You know, four o'clock is okay with me. I'm kind of flexible hours. And when you said you want to disagree with something, you did it respectfully, thoughtfully. Not like the other night.

  56. And Mark ran over there, inspected the truck to make sure what was in the back of the dump truck. It was just a couple pieces of cement. And then asked them, you know, let's stay off these roads. But it was a, we're doing what we call a punch list right now. Yeah. And it's great to see the neighbors calling and protecting the road. I just love that. I think it's awesome. But I also informed the Village Police about it and asked them to help monitor it as well. Yeah, it's, um... This is Mark who works for the... Yeah, Mark Messler. Mark Messler. He works. He's our country. He's our country. He came over. He works for us. He works for us. Uh, us. So again, just a thought on some of the metrics and just to let you know that the team, the road commission people are being responsive, they're taking input. They've been very supportive. Not everything's going to get fixed, of course, and there's going to be other issues that pop up. I'm pleased if they're helping us. Thank you very much. You know, and I want to thank you for coming to these meetings. You've come to almost every one. And I thank you for that. And I'm glad to see you here. Well, I appreciate that. Thank you. You're a fan. I'm still working. You know, four o'clock is okay with me. I'm kind of flexible hours. And when you said you want to disagree with something, you did it respectfully, thoughtfully. Not like the other night. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you for your work. Well, this isn't Beverly Hill. No, I'm not talking about that. Never mind. Never mind. Never mind. We appreciate your summaries and comments as well. Absolutely. All right. Anything else? Good. Very good. I move we adjourn. Okay. Thank you all very, very much. Steve, John, we're going to meet just for a few minutes. Okay? Okay.