the-compact
Road Advisory Committee Thursday, February 5, 2026 · 63 min

Bloomfield Township Road Advisory Committee Meeting on February 4, 2026

Summary

The city council meeting discussed road damage, funding, and infrastructure mitigation, including potential solutions such as mileage-based taxes and damage assessments.

  • Council members discussed revenue models and road damage caused by large house construction.
  • Residents proposed assessing damage as a revenue source to mitigate road damage.
  • The city council discussed a mileage-based tax to address infrastructure damage.
  • County officials discussed road damage and funding issues due to snowplowing and salting.
  • The city council discussed committee assignments and tasks for various projects, including road preservation and federal funding.

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Topics

Transcript

Click any timestamp to jump the video to that moment. Auto-transcribed; expect occasional errors on proper nouns.

  1. Call the meeting to order. We have a forum. We're only missing one person who will be here shortly, so that's great. The minutes from the January 7th meeting, we all had those. We got those online. Anybody have any corrections or changes? No. No comments? Motion to accept. Move and seconded. All those in favor? Aye. Any opposed? Okay. We have a couple of things on today's agenda to do. First, we want to go back over this list. We refined it last time, and if you have any of your recommendations, and then we want to split these. We want to split into subcommittees for this. That's one thing, and then I said I wanted to talk about the township-to-city discussion, just to bring up some information that I've refined on. So, firstly, Jeff, maybe you want to start on that? Well, we handed out the last meeting, and this was a draft to start our thinking, kind of follow like we did in Phase 1, where we identify four or five major initiatives or thoughts or ideas, and then once we decide those are the avenues we want to travel, we can then break it into individual subgroups, and then that will bring us back to as a whole committee with a recommendation or recommendations to the board. So, this was an attempt to kind of define major... categories that we want to pursue to help develop some recommendations okay does anybody have any um any comments any anything they want to add to that anyone anything no i think we should kind of move towards you know moving on with and trying to get some substance that we can right we can actually digest yeah i i i have one comment to this is that for me the big thing that's missing from this list is how to mitigate further damages from happening i think our our method of analyzing properties pre and post uh construction are archaic i think our ability our our lack of taxing people based on the amount of tonnage that's being moved in and out of the property for the for the construction is non-existent and no doubt there are all these other obvious sources of potential

  2. and then once we decide those are the avenues we want to travel, we can then break it into individual subgroups, and then that will bring us back to as a whole committee with a recommendation or recommendations to the board. So, this was an attempt to kind of define major... categories that we want to pursue to help develop some recommendations okay does anybody have any um any comments any anything they want to add to that anyone anything no i think we should kind of move towards you know moving on with and trying to get some substance that we can right we can actually digest yeah i i i have one comment to this is that for me the big thing that's missing from this list is how to mitigate further damages from happening i think our our method of analyzing properties pre and post uh construction are archaic i think our ability our our lack of taxing people based on the amount of tonnage that's being moved in and out of the property for the for the construction is non-existent and no doubt there are all these other obvious sources of potential revenue but if you keep tearing down 2500 square foot houses and keep putting up six and seven thousand square foot houses you can't generate enough revenue with this with these models in order to prevent the damage from coming from from happening faster my comment okay so what would you suggest add another other you i would have seven i seven on here now yeah but you know six and seven are just throw away so i mean but whatever i i mean i think if i i think it would be added in there my my perspective would fall into two different two different categories one is from the township perspective uh should we be recommending to the board that they analyze the methodologies of of pre and post uh construction site inspection and also reanalyze the methodologies of of assigning assigning a call it a tax or a cost of building permits based on the amount of tonnage that is

  3. the construction is non-existent and no doubt there are all these other obvious sources of potential revenue but if you keep tearing down 2500 square foot houses and keep putting up six and seven thousand square foot houses you can't generate enough revenue with this with these models in order to prevent the damage from coming from from happening faster my comment okay so what would you suggest add another other you i would have seven i seven on here now yeah but you know six and seven are just throw away so i mean but whatever i i mean i think if i i think it would be added in there my my perspective would fall into two different two different categories one is from the township perspective uh should we be recommending to the board that they analyze the methodologies of of pre and post uh construction site inspection and also reanalyze the methodologies of of assigning assigning a call it a tax or a cost of building permits based on the amount of tonnage that is going to be moved along the roads within that subdivision um and you know we're tearing down houses that have real values of 400 to 450 000 and we're putting up three four and five million dollar houses um and we're destroying the roads doing it i think that i think that there's a methodology of of scientifically analyzing the the damage to the roads i think people are good friends that the road commission and mdot are more than capable of giving us science of how to do that based on tonnage and the size of vehicles uh and i also think that that we can analyze a tax recommended tax that would be based on that tonnage of mass going in and out and then secondly I think that who's benefiting from all this road Commission doesn't have any money we know they don't have any money maybe they will someday but they pull their pockets inside out that when we tear down these smaller houses and we put up these big multi-million dollar houses the township makes more money on taxes and the county makes more money on taxes hi I mean I

  4. assigning a call it a tax or a cost of building permits based on the amount of tonnage that is going to be moved along the roads within that subdivision um and you know we're tearing down houses that have real values of 400 to 450 000 and we're putting up three four and five million dollar houses um and we're destroying the roads doing it i think that i think that there's a methodology of of scientifically analyzing the the damage to the roads i think people are good friends that the road commission and mdot are more than capable of giving us science of how to do that based on tonnage and the size of vehicles uh and i also think that that we can analyze a tax recommended tax that would be based on that tonnage of mass going in and out and then secondly I think that who's benefiting from all this road Commission doesn't have any money we know they don't have any money maybe they will someday but they pull their pockets inside out that when we tear down these smaller houses and we put up these big multi-million dollar houses the township makes more money on taxes and the county makes more money on taxes hi I mean I feel it would be fair for some percentage of that to be reallocated back to roads and even a step further to allocate or prioritize the usage of it in the communities were worth that type of construction is happening well for that that's already being looked at review township millage for funding of roads it has to do and we had a meeting about this about how the headley amendment works and how we can work with that to do just what you're saying is this somehow keep that so I think that's up there but mitigating the damage and or paying for the damage that's two separate things mitigating maybe limiting the amount of tonnage whatever what all these things I think that I would think that perhaps we could remove six which is one item federal funding which who knows and that could be put into something else can you do and edit edit time of damage mitigation changing and zoning or zoning ordinances to help prevent that limit the size of trucks coming in of equipment etc etc I don't know the answer but I mean to add to look at that you

  5. makes more money on taxes and the county makes more money on taxes hi I mean I feel it would be fair for some percentage of that to be reallocated back to roads and even a step further to allocate or prioritize the usage of it in the communities were worth that type of construction is happening well for that that's already being looked at review township millage for funding of roads it has to do and we had a meeting about this about how the headley amendment works and how we can work with that to do just what you're saying is this somehow keep that so I think that's up there but mitigating the damage and or paying for the damage that's two separate things mitigating maybe limiting the amount of tonnage whatever what all these things I think that I would think that perhaps we could remove six which is one item federal funding which who knows and that could be put into something else can you do and edit edit time of damage mitigation changing and zoning or zoning ordinances to help prevent that limit the size of trucks coming in of equipment etc etc I don't know the answer but I mean to add to look at that you know in a separate that's fine I'm in harmony with that as well I'm just saying is that if we don't recommend ways to mitigate the damage going forward or at least make the the properties that are being developed pay for some of that mitigation you're never going to raise enough money with taxes and I also believe as I said that that if the county is making more money off increase in property debt property taxes and the township is making more money off the increase of property taxes some percentage even if it's ten percent some modest percentage of that increase should go back into the community but but then you're asking to I don't know that the tax structure of the township would invite such a thing well maybe the township needs to look at changing the tax structure well and that could be but I think our job is to recommend things that could happen and and obviously rely on the township supervisors to to prevent presenters with challenges that we might have to

  6. trucks coming in of equipment etc etc I don't know the answer but I mean to add to look at that you know in a separate that's fine I'm in harmony with that as well I'm just saying is that if we don't recommend ways to mitigate the damage going forward or at least make the the properties that are being developed pay for some of that mitigation you're never going to raise enough money with taxes and I also believe as I said that that if the county is making more money off increase in property debt property taxes and the township is making more money off the increase of property taxes some percentage even if it's ten percent some modest percentage of that increase should go back into the community but but then you're asking to I don't know that the tax structure of the township would invite such a thing well maybe the township needs to look at changing the tax structure well and that could be but I think our job is to recommend things that could happen and and obviously rely on the township supervisors to to prevent presenters with challenges that we might have to look at in order to implement well at some point they're gonna have to weigh in on a lot of these things and sure that could we could bring that up but I'm not aware that when you get a permit they figure out how much it weighs but they don't do they don't they don't they don't they haven't changed the permitting methodology of probably 50 years so they also visually inspect to the road in front of the property before the construction starts and after the construction ends visually to see if there's any obvious pothole damage well potholes don't happen we you've destroyed the infrastructure under the road what are in our neighborhood you could never do that because the damage is equal yeah so it just comes down to that we've got a record yes a way Steve could I suggest that we take the funding review the federal fund review under six and move it up and add it to five so that it says Oakland County and federal okay and so it combined the two and then make a new number six that would be the damage mitigation or you know we're just sustaining the health of good roads have a general generalized term we could take that point included three which we're

  7. look at in order to implement well at some point they're gonna have to weigh in on a lot of these things and sure that could we could bring that up but I'm not aware that when you get a permit they figure out how much it weighs but they don't do they don't they don't they don't they haven't changed the permitting methodology of probably 50 years so they also visually inspect to the road in front of the property before the construction starts and after the construction ends visually to see if there's any obvious pothole damage well potholes don't happen we you've destroyed the infrastructure under the road what are in our neighborhood you could never do that because the damage is equal yeah so it just comes down to that we've got a record yes a way Steve could I suggest that we take the funding review the federal fund review under six and move it up and add it to five so that it says Oakland County and federal okay and so it combined the two and then make a new number six that would be the damage mitigation or you know we're just sustaining the health of good roads have a general generalized term we could take that point included three which we're talking about the township and village and other revenue sources that's another yeah and that way it kind of puts awesome so You don't want to fragment into two pieces. So my suggestion is it includes it as part of three, and then that's dealing with all potential sources of revenue for the pounders. OK, but what about the fact that should we be looking at to mitigate the damage, not only the funding, that's one part of it, but what about changing ordinances to prevent damage from overusing the roads, heavier trucks, equipment, et cetera, et cetera, and all those things that Fred brought up. That's not about money only. It's about- Require a bond. Like, and Fred's talking about there's in spec before, and if there's damage, then the bond would pay for the damage. And I'm seeing it. I spent a lot of time working on transportation with MDOT and with the RCOC years ago, and I'm certainly not a scientist from that perspective. But I do know that they have the modeling tools that can tell you for the weight of a vehicle traversing over

  8. a general generalized term we could take that point included three which we're talking about the township and village and other revenue sources that's another yeah and that way it kind of puts awesome so You don't want to fragment into two pieces. So my suggestion is it includes it as part of three, and then that's dealing with all potential sources of revenue for the pounders. OK, but what about the fact that should we be looking at to mitigate the damage, not only the funding, that's one part of it, but what about changing ordinances to prevent damage from overusing the roads, heavier trucks, equipment, et cetera, et cetera, and all those things that Fred brought up. That's not about money only. It's about- Require a bond. Like, and Fred's talking about there's in spec before, and if there's damage, then the bond would pay for the damage. And I'm seeing it. I spent a lot of time working on transportation with MDOT and with the RCOC years ago, and I'm certainly not a scientist from that perspective. But I do know that they have the modeling tools that can tell you for the weight of a vehicle traversing over a certain piece of asphalt. They can tell you how much damage that vehicle's doing to the asphalt over time. So the models are there. We're just not using them. And I know I even talked to some of my neighbors. If you're building a $3 million house, and suddenly you have a $10,000 damage tax, or however you want to call it, to take care of the road. Are you going to not move into Bloomfield Township because it's a rounding error on the $3 million you're spending on the house? We're leaving money on the table as a township is what I'm getting at. And we're allowing the builders to cause further damage, accelerate the damage to the roads. I think what Jeff said, I think that's a good idea. I like that. When it comes to have a 3C, possibility for funding through new funding roads through new construction bonding or something. I don't know if the words missed that. But I like that in there. But I do like the idea of adding something to find out how to prevent new roads, brand new ones, or some roads that are now in fair condition, that maybe have mill and overlay, for instance, from not being further damaged by new construction of heavy equipment.

  9. can tell you for the weight of a vehicle traversing over a certain piece of asphalt. They can tell you how much damage that vehicle's doing to the asphalt over time. So the models are there. We're just not using them. And I know I even talked to some of my neighbors. If you're building a $3 million house, and suddenly you have a $10,000 damage tax, or however you want to call it, to take care of the road. Are you going to not move into Bloomfield Township because it's a rounding error on the $3 million you're spending on the house? We're leaving money on the table as a township is what I'm getting at. And we're allowing the builders to cause further damage, accelerate the damage to the roads. I think what Jeff said, I think that's a good idea. I like that. When it comes to have a 3C, possibility for funding through new funding roads through new construction bonding or something. I don't know if the words missed that. But I like that in there. But I do like the idea of adding something to find out how to prevent new roads, brand new ones, or some roads that are now in fair condition, that maybe have mill and overlay, for instance, from not being further damaged by new construction of heavy equipment. And I think we need to look into that as a way. So what I would suggest is move funding from new construction, and I don't want to confuse that with millage from new construction or increased taxes, but for funding from building, the building process is what I'm going to get. Thank you. permitting process the permitting process okay it's still kind of attacks like that would be 3c okay I guess I'm a little I'm a little reticent to get into figuring out what because it's not just heavy equipment that damages roads the the the wet I forget the word they use but the wet pool or the water pool or the water table also does it so who's in charge of the water table who's in charge of where the water goes who's in charge of we put salt on the roads should

  10. But I like that in there. But I do like the idea of adding something to find out how to prevent new roads, brand new ones, or some roads that are now in fair condition, that maybe have mill and overlay, for instance, from not being further damaged by new construction of heavy equipment. And I think we need to look into that as a way. So what I would suggest is move funding from new construction, and I don't want to confuse that with millage from new construction or increased taxes, but for funding from building, the building process is what I'm going to get. Thank you. permitting process the permitting process okay it's still kind of attacks like that would be 3c okay I guess I'm a little I'm a little reticent to get into figuring out what because it's not just heavy equipment that damages roads the the the wet I forget the word they use but the wet pool or the water pool or the water table also does it so who's in charge of the water table who's in charge of where the water goes who's in charge of we put salt on the roads should we not put salt on those roads because they don't want to pay the taxes they did pay the tech I don't know that that's really what I mean it's a consideration to try to put that in there as a revenue source but how you would do that because it would never end well I think if you put it in and I think if you do we can then call on our good friends at the Road Commission to tell us how would we how would we assess make a recommendation on how to assess what kind of damage is being done because it's it's not it's inconceivable to me that you can move a million tons of dirt out of a job site with these gigantic twin tandem trucks that'll carry 50 60 yards of dirt together and not cause some damage to the road you know it's a weight over time issue that's what you know if you think about think about how it's just creating micro fractures to the infrastructure underneath the the layer of the asphalt that's there and you create those micro fractures long enough and eventually you get a pothole but you don't get a pothole if

  11. charge of where the water goes who's in charge of we put salt on the roads should we not put salt on those roads because they don't want to pay the taxes they did pay the tech I don't know that that's really what I mean it's a consideration to try to put that in there as a revenue source but how you would do that because it would never end well I think if you put it in and I think if you do we can then call on our good friends at the Road Commission to tell us how would we how would we assess make a recommendation on how to assess what kind of damage is being done because it's it's not it's inconceivable to me that you can move a million tons of dirt out of a job site with these gigantic twin tandem trucks that'll carry 50 60 yards of dirt together and not cause some damage to the road you know it's a weight over time issue that's what you know if you think about think about how it's just creating micro fractures to the infrastructure underneath the the layer of the asphalt that's there and you create those micro fractures long enough and eventually you get a pothole but you don't get a pothole if you don't create the micro front micro fractures you know well the last time we in our subdivision went through this process of the sad which failed the biggest complaint the biggest reason was well we can do that and build all these brand-new roads but then all this heavy equipment that comes in to build the new houses it's going to damage brand-new roads that's why I like the idea of adding that something to talk about that in this process because everything here is just about funding which is important obviously but but what about that what about how do we stop that heavy equipment from damaging new roads brand new ones that it we've just paid for or roads that are okay and now they're building and and the damage they're breaking through those and now those have to be replaced so I like the idea of putting that in I mean we obviously have to do a lot more investigation on the topic but I can tell you that the science is there to verify what we're talking about do you know anywhere else where they do that no I don't I don't I mean we build stuff in Southfield with stuff in later Pugh builds in Lathrop you

  12. micro fractures long enough and eventually you get a pothole but you don't get a pothole if you don't create the micro front micro fractures you know well the last time we in our subdivision went through this process of the sad which failed the biggest complaint the biggest reason was well we can do that and build all these brand-new roads but then all this heavy equipment that comes in to build the new houses it's going to damage brand-new roads that's why I like the idea of adding that something to talk about that in this process because everything here is just about funding which is important obviously but but what about that what about how do we stop that heavy equipment from damaging new roads brand new ones that it we've just paid for or roads that are okay and now they're building and and the damage they're breaking through those and now those have to be replaced so I like the idea of putting that in I mean we obviously have to do a lot more investigation on the topic but I can tell you that the science is there to verify what we're talking about do you know anywhere else where they do that no I don't I don't I mean we build stuff in Southfield with stuff in later Pugh builds in Lathrop you in Bloomfield I mean that's just not no one goes to that part of the weeds it's it's a great idea but no one goes into that part of the weeds it's it's you know how much mechanical things do you have to pay attention to to do that so I mean it's it's it's I don't know that we're ready to break new ground on how on that stuff because we're trying to figure out whether or not they should fund the roads at all well if you remember one of the goals of this was an open a clean sheet of paper where any idea well that's why I said it's a good we'll throw another idea but it would be a stretch let's put it that way well you know five years ago the state of Oregon implemented a a use tax instead of a gas tax based on mileage first first state in the country to do it today there's five other states that are doing it and the concept of it is growing so I think just because we don't know of anybody that's doing this quite frankly I don't know that there isn't other people doing it what I do know is that what we're what what we're talking about is not it's not impossible because of the lack of

  13. in Bloomfield I mean that's just not no one goes to that part of the weeds it's it's a great idea but no one goes into that part of the weeds it's it's you know how much mechanical things do you have to pay attention to to do that so I mean it's it's it's I don't know that we're ready to break new ground on how on that stuff because we're trying to figure out whether or not they should fund the roads at all well if you remember one of the goals of this was an open a clean sheet of paper where any idea well that's why I said it's a good we'll throw another idea but it would be a stretch let's put it that way well you know five years ago the state of Oregon implemented a a use tax instead of a gas tax based on mileage first first state in the country to do it today there's five other states that are doing it and the concept of it is growing so I think just because we don't know of anybody that's doing this quite frankly I don't know that there isn't other people doing it what I do know is that what we're what what we're talking about is not it's not impossible because of the lack of science on how to do it and maybe we find out that it's a great idea and nobody wants to do it but It proves that we can't beAY right but it we can't afford but So I think if you can't mitigate the acceleration of the damage, you're blown into the wind to see how much money you can raise to fix roads. How does the county deal with this? I mean, the trucks, the vehicles, I'm assuming, that's the heaviest truck on there, permitted. It's the snowplow. So do they do that, too? I'm sure the flowers do damage, especially with this cold weather. If you've been driving down some of these roads, it feels like a washboard, and so we're going to have a lot of issues come spring when the thaw hits. And I think what Fred's getting at in these neighborhoods, because of the microcracking you referred to it as, we're going to probably see, I was talking to DPW today about it, get ready for the patchwork. It's going to be extra heavy this season. On my way here, there was a patch guy in the neighborhood adjacent to him. I waved to him, I said, how are you doing? Well, we had a meeting, I met with Noah, our DPW director, and Jimmy Gallagher, and I met with the road commission last week.

  14. what what we're talking about is not it's not impossible because of the lack of science on how to do it and maybe we find out that it's a great idea and nobody wants to do it but It proves that we can't beAY right but it we can't afford but So I think if you can't mitigate the acceleration of the damage, you're blown into the wind to see how much money you can raise to fix roads. How does the county deal with this? I mean, the trucks, the vehicles, I'm assuming, that's the heaviest truck on there, permitted. It's the snowplow. So do they do that, too? I'm sure the flowers do damage, especially with this cold weather. If you've been driving down some of these roads, it feels like a washboard, and so we're going to have a lot of issues come spring when the thaw hits. And I think what Fred's getting at in these neighborhoods, because of the microcracking you referred to it as, we're going to probably see, I was talking to DPW today about it, get ready for the patchwork. It's going to be extra heavy this season. On my way here, there was a patch guy in the neighborhood adjacent to him. I waved to him, I said, how are you doing? Well, we had a meeting, I met with Noah, our DPW director, and Jimmy Gallagher, and I met with the road commission last week. Had a really good meeting with them, talking about the snowplowing and the salting and what we're looking at for funding. And they're starting to tune in a little bit more on the new funding, but they're really not going to see it for a year. And again, what they talked about is underwriting these SADs or participating more in these SADs, but I think they're still waiting to find out exactly when that money's going to come in. So, but... they're having a hard time finding drivers to plow roads. So if you're seeing gaps, and we see them right now, it's because they're having a hard time staffing the plow trucks. And they get these young people in that don't want to work extra hours. And these can be 12 to 16 hour shifts. And then the other issue is some of them can't pass a drug test because they're marijuana. Marijuana. Not that there's anything wrong with that. That's what I was told. Not that there's anything wrong with that. So they have some real challenges themselves right now. And they're working through them. Does the county, this is an aside, do they require a marijuana test before you hire somebody? We do.

  15. Well, we had a meeting, I met with Noah, our DPW director, and Jimmy Gallagher, and I met with the road commission last week. Had a really good meeting with them, talking about the snowplowing and the salting and what we're looking at for funding. And they're starting to tune in a little bit more on the new funding, but they're really not going to see it for a year. And again, what they talked about is underwriting these SADs or participating more in these SADs, but I think they're still waiting to find out exactly when that money's going to come in. So, but... they're having a hard time finding drivers to plow roads. So if you're seeing gaps, and we see them right now, it's because they're having a hard time staffing the plow trucks. And they get these young people in that don't want to work extra hours. And these can be 12 to 16 hour shifts. And then the other issue is some of them can't pass a drug test because they're marijuana. Marijuana. Not that there's anything wrong with that. That's what I was told. Not that there's anything wrong with that. So they have some real challenges themselves right now. And they're working through them. Does the county, this is an aside, do they require a marijuana test before you hire somebody? We do. Okay, that's good. And if we find it, we're prohibited from hiring them. A lot of places have gone away with it because they can't hire anybody. But if you're driving a 60,000 pound truck, and then put another 15,000 pounds of salt in it, I mean, that's a... They're driving anything. Yeah, yeah. And then there's a salt issue too. So I'm trying to keep up with salt right now. We've gone through more salt. I think we're about... What's she... What did they say? She said 130% of the budget. Already, year-to-date for our budget. December alone, we had 17 or 18 events. I don't know how many events... We've had a long time. Normally four. Normally four. And I'm not sure how many events in January. And I think this weekend we're due to get... another one to three inches it's Michigan winter and so those those take up our costs if you go back 20 25 years it was not one to two inches was five to ten inches every other day it was well we're a more small little six-year-olds that member okay you know what though to move it along if you maybe what you should do is make a motion to add damage mitigation okay into the number six

  16. We do. Okay, that's good. And if we find it, we're prohibited from hiring them. A lot of places have gone away with it because they can't hire anybody. But if you're driving a 60,000 pound truck, and then put another 15,000 pounds of salt in it, I mean, that's a... They're driving anything. Yeah, yeah. And then there's a salt issue too. So I'm trying to keep up with salt right now. We've gone through more salt. I think we're about... What's she... What did they say? She said 130% of the budget. Already, year-to-date for our budget. December alone, we had 17 or 18 events. I don't know how many events... We've had a long time. Normally four. Normally four. And I'm not sure how many events in January. And I think this weekend we're due to get... another one to three inches it's Michigan winter and so those those take up our costs if you go back 20 25 years it was not one to two inches was five to ten inches every other day it was well we're a more small little six-year-olds that member okay you know what though to move it along if you maybe what you should do is make a motion to add damage mitigation okay into the number six position see if it see what people think I think that's the way to do it okay I move to add damage mitigation onto this list and item number six is there a second for that we second it any discussion on that leave it broad like that's good to leave it broad because then you can and I you can you can work on that committee okay all those in favor of doing that say aye aye any opposed okay good so that's on here damage mitigation leave it broad and that wouldn't be you know do we need to change ordinances so lower the the double tandem gravel haul they're coming through 14 of the day maybe we can't do that I don't know I know I'm not saying that's the answer but we can you can look at there's we've got to open this up to consciousness to thinking because there's lots of ways to look at it you're not going to change if somebody's building a certain size house and and there's a million square yards of a million pounds of dirt you still got to move it the question is do you move it in 10 truckloads or you move it within 30 truckloads and and again I think we need to bring in some of our friends at MDOT and RCOC that can they have that they have the knowledge

  17. should do is make a motion to add damage mitigation okay into the number six position see if it see what people think I think that's the way to do it okay I move to add damage mitigation onto this list and item number six is there a second for that we second it any discussion on that leave it broad like that's good to leave it broad because then you can and I you can you can work on that committee okay all those in favor of doing that say aye aye any opposed okay good so that's on here damage mitigation leave it broad and that wouldn't be you know do we need to change ordinances so lower the the double tandem gravel haul they're coming through 14 of the day maybe we can't do that I don't know I know I'm not saying that's the answer but we can you can look at there's we've got to open this up to consciousness to thinking because there's lots of ways to look at it you're not going to change if somebody's building a certain size house and and there's a million square yards of a million pounds of dirt you still got to move it the question is do you move it in 10 truckloads or you move it within 30 truckloads and and again I think we need to bring in some of our friends at MDOT and RCOC that can they have that they have the knowledge base to tell us about that all right so that's that's another that's that's a committee there now yes are we moving federal to number five yeah are we leaving no federal yeah yeah we moved the federal to five okay that's what I think we said right yeah okay I just and slightly cut count with Oakland County slash federal yes okay there's anything there we can do that okay okay I just okay so now do we just accept this now as it is or do we just that's it which we need to move that do you think or we just now divide up into these different committees what do you want to work on I think we're ready to divide it okay right they all need work obviously well you and it's there's seven areas here and there's you know that we can't have just one person working on each one so we're gonna have to double up not to take more than one so why don't we start right now um fund increase funding from township debt you need let's say two people to work on that okay so let's just do volunteers how was it Jeff

  18. of our friends at MDOT and RCOC that can they have that they have the knowledge base to tell us about that all right so that's that's another that's that's a committee there now yes are we moving federal to number five yeah are we leaving no federal yeah yeah we moved the federal to five okay that's what I think we said right yeah okay I just and slightly cut count with Oakland County slash federal yes okay there's anything there we can do that okay okay I just okay so now do we just accept this now as it is or do we just that's it which we need to move that do you think or we just now divide up into these different committees what do you want to work on I think we're ready to divide it okay right they all need work obviously well you and it's there's seven areas here and there's you know that we can't have just one person working on each one so we're gonna have to double up not to take more than one so why don't we start right now um fund increase funding from township debt you need let's say two people to work on that okay so let's just do volunteers how was it Jeff You need one other person, Mike, maybe? I think? Nope. All right. Addendum high funding from the RCOC from state 2026 budget and beyond. You've got the contact. Yeah, I would have to. That's really the one I want to do. Okay. Then I'm done. Yeah, but you've got the contact with stuff. Yeah, yeah. All right, and one other person. I'll work on that with you. Okay. I wanted to work on number four, becoming a city, so I'm going to hold off until that gets there. I wanted to do that, too. All right, well, here we go. All right, let's become a city. All right, so Jeff S., Jeff S., and Steve. Okay, so now back to review. Township millage for funding of roads, including the new number C, funding from permitting process. Okay. Gary. I'll work on it.

  19. You need one other person, Mike, maybe? I think? Nope. All right. Addendum high funding from the RCOC from state 2026 budget and beyond. You've got the contact. Yeah, I would have to. That's really the one I want to do. Okay. Then I'm done. Yeah, but you've got the contact with stuff. Yeah, yeah. All right, and one other person. I'll work on that with you. Okay. I wanted to work on number four, becoming a city, so I'm going to hold off until that gets there. I wanted to do that, too. All right, well, here we go. All right, let's become a city. All right, so Jeff S., Jeff S., and Steve. Okay, so now back to review. Township millage for funding of roads, including the new number C, funding from permitting process. Okay. Gary. I'll work on it. Which one was that, Fred? Number three, yes. Three. That's going to be you, Gary, Gary, and Fred. Okay, and so your second one, Fred, would be- damage mitigation yeah so you've got two it's the new number six right yeah Mindy you want to work on that one with Fred that'd be great yeah because you've got those new roads and I think it's going to be important to try and preserve those right okay Mike that'd be great okay investigate any federal funding any funding possibilities with Oakland County and federal I'll work on that I'm willing to join Mike great and then we have down here determined changes needed to PA 51 you and you said that that was a I think it's very important to be honest with you but you said it's kind of a throwaway no I was saying the number six was I thought you said six and seven well and we all know about 51 I think we need

  20. I'll work on it. Which one was that, Fred? Number three, yes. Three. That's going to be you, Gary, Gary, and Fred. Okay, and so your second one, Fred, would be- damage mitigation yeah so you've got two it's the new number six right yeah Mindy you want to work on that one with Fred that'd be great yeah because you've got those new roads and I think it's going to be important to try and preserve those right okay Mike that'd be great okay investigate any federal funding any funding possibilities with Oakland County and federal I'll work on that I'm willing to join Mike great and then we have down here determined changes needed to PA 51 you and you said that that was a I think it's very important to be honest with you but you said it's kind of a throwaway no I was saying the number six was I thought you said six and seven well and we all know about 51 I think we need this we've got to address that whether it's hopeless or it's possibility I'll put my name down for even as a third one I'll put the I'd like to because I think that's very important yeah I'll join you on that Jeff okay great okay so that's we have at least two we have two people on each one of those oh no Mindy which one are you yeah I'll do it do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll go I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do one yeah on which one number six and let's say okay sorry she's not here Mike were you also working on that one no no you're not I'm working on the funding I made a mistake okay all right okay so that's the two we'll start so we'll start working on those it takes to get through it timeline a month because we're alternating meetings so we're back to roads focus on roads a lot there's a lot to get through here so why don't we say a month is not six six weeks yeah let's say this is how about April that's like

  21. know about 51 I think we need this we've got to address that whether it's hopeless or it's possibility I'll put my name down for even as a third one I'll put the I'd like to because I think that's very important yeah I'll join you on that Jeff okay great okay so that's we have at least two we have two people on each one of those oh no Mindy which one are you yeah I'll do it do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll go I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do it I'll do one yeah on which one number six and let's say okay sorry she's not here Mike were you also working on that one no no you're not I'm working on the funding I made a mistake okay all right okay so that's the two we'll start so we'll start working on those it takes to get through it timeline a month because we're alternating meetings so we're back to roads focus on roads a lot there's a lot to get through here so why don't we say a month is not six six weeks yeah let's say this is how about April that's like six weeks or so what about the by the end of April and it yeah end of April but you could have some of them sooner I mean yeah right now everything comes in at once right we ought to try to come up with a standard have your reports turned in by the end of April sooner okay so for 29 okay that gives enough tax like two months almost all of February we just started all of March and all of it's almost three months but that's all right because that's that brings us almost to one year one you committee started so maybe we can wrap it up by the end of spring okay anybody anything else you want to talk about on this particular this okay then the next thing is uh i'll i'll lead on this the township um the discussion of township to city discussion um a lot of people i've had a lot of people say why don't we um and uh have discussion and there's no answer right now yet and then yeah what really got me looking at this was that one of the meetings of a presentation i

  22. a month is not six six weeks yeah let's say this is how about April that's like six weeks or so what about the by the end of April and it yeah end of April but you could have some of them sooner I mean yeah right now everything comes in at once right we ought to try to come up with a standard have your reports turned in by the end of April sooner okay so for 29 okay that gives enough tax like two months almost all of February we just started all of March and all of it's almost three months but that's all right because that's that brings us almost to one year one you committee started so maybe we can wrap it up by the end of spring okay anybody anything else you want to talk about on this particular this okay then the next thing is uh i'll i'll lead on this the township um the discussion of township to city discussion um a lot of people i've had a lot of people say why don't we um and uh have discussion and there's no answer right now yet and then yeah what really got me looking at this was that one of the meetings of a presentation i think i know who it was but it doesn't matter i asked the question how have any other townships in michigan converted and changed the cities and the answer i got was no we don't know i don't know of any that was the answer and that's i said wow really so i started doing the research and you got a list and for those who people you know um that are watching this or aren't didn't get this already it's quite a long list now some of these some of them may have i didn't wasn't able to go through everyone and find out there may be some in here that that became that part of a township became a city now if you just to go back a little bit the state of michigan was laid out i think in the 1830 i don't know when it was it was laid out in six by six basically townships and the idea was that cities would take township um property land, whatever, to either enlarge the cities or become cities. The city of Bloomfield Hills, for instance, that was all enclosed in the six by six Bloomfield Township. They became a city and that was a township property.

  23. and then yeah what really got me looking at this was that one of the meetings of a presentation i think i know who it was but it doesn't matter i asked the question how have any other townships in michigan converted and changed the cities and the answer i got was no we don't know i don't know of any that was the answer and that's i said wow really so i started doing the research and you got a list and for those who people you know um that are watching this or aren't didn't get this already it's quite a long list now some of these some of them may have i didn't wasn't able to go through everyone and find out there may be some in here that that became that part of a township became a city now if you just to go back a little bit the state of michigan was laid out i think in the 1830 i don't know when it was it was laid out in six by six basically townships and the idea was that cities would take township um property land, whatever, to either enlarge the cities or become cities. The city of Bloomfield Hills, for instance, that was all enclosed in the six by six Bloomfield Township. They became a city and that was a township property. The city of Southfield, Royal Oak, for instance. The city of Royal Oak was out of Royal Oak Township. Now, Royal Oak Township still exists. And it took part of the Royal Oak Township and became the city of Royal Oak. In fact, we have the experience right here of the Bloomfield, what's it called again? Telegraph, the Tri-Party Agreement, 25, what's the name of it? We're the big project that took 20 years to do. Bloomfield Park? Bloomfield Park, okay, I couldn't think of the name. Okay, that was taken and put into the city of Southfield from Bloomfield Township as part of the process. Pontiac. Pontiac. When I said, I meant Pontiac, I'm sorry, I meant Pontiac, right. And so that's the process. And now they're destroying it. The same with Lincoln Hills and Springdale Golf Courses. That was old Bloomfield Township property, and the city of Birmingham annexed that property through the process. I think it was Public Act 25, I think is what it is. And then we ended up with the Birmingham Country Club, which is, which is, is that in Bloomfield Township? Yes, it is. Because it's in Birmingham. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

  24. They became a city and that was a township property. The city of Southfield, Royal Oak, for instance. The city of Royal Oak was out of Royal Oak Township. Now, Royal Oak Township still exists. And it took part of the Royal Oak Township and became the city of Royal Oak. In fact, we have the experience right here of the Bloomfield, what's it called again? Telegraph, the Tri-Party Agreement, 25, what's the name of it? We're the big project that took 20 years to do. Bloomfield Park? Bloomfield Park, okay, I couldn't think of the name. Okay, that was taken and put into the city of Southfield from Bloomfield Township as part of the process. Pontiac. Pontiac. When I said, I meant Pontiac, I'm sorry, I meant Pontiac, right. And so that's the process. And now they're destroying it. The same with Lincoln Hills and Springdale Golf Courses. That was old Bloomfield Township property, and the city of Birmingham annexed that property through the process. I think it was Public Act 25, I think is what it is. And then we ended up with the Birmingham Country Club, which is, which is, is that in Bloomfield Township? Yes, it is. Because it's in Birmingham. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. There used to be a township of Auburn Heights, and Pontiac started to snap up parts of that, and so it became Auburn Hills, the city of Auburn Hills. Auburn Heights became Auburn Hills. So my point is that on this list, there's a lot on here that they became, Troy Township became the city of Troy. The whole township became the city of Troy. There's a lot of listing, so it's possible. It happens. And so it's not impossible. In fact, it's more than zero. More than zero. Yeah, a lot more. But nevertheless, there is a process to do that, and it's not all that difficult, the process, from what I found. Let me just go over it. There's a procedure. First, there's the initial planning procedure. The township leadership, the legal counsel, they decide whether a corporation is diet or feasible. Then the population has to be assessed because there is a minimum requirement of 500,000 people per square mile that are acquired, 750 to 2,000, excuse me, with density requirements.

  25. There used to be a township of Auburn Heights, and Pontiac started to snap up parts of that, and so it became Auburn Hills, the city of Auburn Hills. Auburn Heights became Auburn Hills. So my point is that on this list, there's a lot on here that they became, Troy Township became the city of Troy. The whole township became the city of Troy. There's a lot of listing, so it's possible. It happens. And so it's not impossible. In fact, it's more than zero. More than zero. Yeah, a lot more. But nevertheless, there is a process to do that, and it's not all that difficult, the process, from what I found. Let me just go over it. There's a procedure. First, there's the initial planning procedure. The township leadership, the legal counsel, they decide whether a corporation is diet or feasible. Then the population has to be assessed because there is a minimum requirement of 500,000 people per square mile that are acquired, 750 to 2,000, excuse me, with density requirements. Then, you need to go to the state boundary commission. Thank you. and work with them before any petition is filed. They review the corporations and boundary changes and will establish the procedure requirements and schedule. Then petitions are filed to initiate, to become a, to incorporation. Then again, the State Boundary Commission has a review. There's more to it than just that. And then there has to be an election of new commissioners so that the government that we have that's in place is dissolved, the elected officials, and new elected officials, mayor, commission, whatever, are elected. Then a city charter has to be created, an effective filing date, and then divisions of assets and liabilities. And so it's, it's, it's not, it's, it's, it's feasible. It takes a lot of time and effort, but there are a long list of pros and cons.

  26. Then the population has to be assessed because there is a minimum requirement of 500,000 people per square mile that are acquired, 750 to 2,000, excuse me, with density requirements. Then, you need to go to the state boundary commission. Thank you. and work with them before any petition is filed. They review the corporations and boundary changes and will establish the procedure requirements and schedule. Then petitions are filed to initiate, to become a, to incorporation. Then again, the State Boundary Commission has a review. There's more to it than just that. And then there has to be an election of new commissioners so that the government that we have that's in place is dissolved, the elected officials, and new elected officials, mayor, commission, whatever, are elected. Then a city charter has to be created, an effective filing date, and then divisions of assets and liabilities. And so it's, it's, it's not, it's, it's, it's feasible. It takes a lot of time and effort, but there are a long list of pros and cons. I think, yeah, you've got that. Oh, I don't know if that was included. Okay, sorry, that wasn't included, but there's a long list of pros and cons, full political and administrative control over local matters. We've talked about that, about roads pertaining to us here. No longer subject to township decisions or priorities. One unified local government is that a two township and village ability to write your own city charter. And it goes on, and I can provide that to you if you want it. There's financial advantages, and there are other things that don't apply just to roads. One thing I can tell you, for instance, as an example, right now the law states, Public Act 116 of 1954, specified that, quote, well, it specified that in townships, all political elections, all people elected must be in a party. Now, they don't specify what the parties are, but they must be in a party. Cities don't have to be. You mean like Catholic and stuff like that? Sorry? No. Well, it can be any party. Any recognized public as the only one of the parties. This is what's going to go. We're putting back that marijuana.

  27. but there are a long list of pros and cons. I think, yeah, you've got that. Oh, I don't know if that was included. Okay, sorry, that wasn't included, but there's a long list of pros and cons, full political and administrative control over local matters. We've talked about that, about roads pertaining to us here. No longer subject to township decisions or priorities. One unified local government is that a two township and village ability to write your own city charter. And it goes on, and I can provide that to you if you want it. There's financial advantages, and there are other things that don't apply just to roads. One thing I can tell you, for instance, as an example, right now the law states, Public Act 116 of 1954, specified that, quote, well, it specified that in townships, all political elections, all people elected must be in a party. Now, they don't specify what the parties are, but they must be in a party. Cities don't have to be. You mean like Catholic and stuff like that? Sorry? No. Well, it can be any party. Any recognized public as the only one of the parties. This is what's going to go. We're putting back that marijuana. A primary, a quote, a primary of all public parties shall be held in every organized township of the state, at which time the qualified and registered electors of each political party may vote for candidate for township officers, offices. That has to be. Now, I've started this discussion, Mike, I've started with some other people. Why do we have to have political parties here? What's the point? Now, if you're a city, what? That's more relevant now than ever. It's not, it's, there's no, in this level, at this level, now, we're getting off on a tangent, and I don't want to do that, but at this level, there's really no reason for it. What's the point? Okay, nevertheless, a city... they're free to do what they want. If you know that Birmingham, some cities, big cities, Detroit, Grand Rapids, some of the big cities, their elected officials are part of a party. They do that. But any of the small cities, any around here, it's not. It's nonpartisan. So a city can do that. You can't do it if you're a township. So in other words, there and there may be, very well may be more than just those things that we're being

  28. We're putting back that marijuana. A primary, a quote, a primary of all public parties shall be held in every organized township of the state, at which time the qualified and registered electors of each political party may vote for candidate for township officers, offices. That has to be. Now, I've started this discussion, Mike, I've started with some other people. Why do we have to have political parties here? What's the point? Now, if you're a city, what? That's more relevant now than ever. It's not, it's, there's no, in this level, at this level, now, we're getting off on a tangent, and I don't want to do that, but at this level, there's really no reason for it. What's the point? Okay, nevertheless, a city... they're free to do what they want. If you know that Birmingham, some cities, big cities, Detroit, Grand Rapids, some of the big cities, their elected officials are part of a party. They do that. But any of the small cities, any around here, it's not. It's nonpartisan. So a city can do that. You can't do it if you're a township. So in other words, there and there may be, very well may be more than just those things that we're being restricted because we're a township or a township is restricted to. So since we're talking about an open, clean sheet of paper, there may very well be some very good advantages for Bloomfield Township to no longer be a township but become a city. It may not be. It may be awful. It may be just, we may not be able to. But I would believe, in my opinion, that's why I put it, I wanted to put it on our list of the committees, is to investigate that, is to get answers. What would be the difference between the funding for roads if we were a city rather than a township? What about Headley overrides? How does that work with a city rather than a township? What about other things about, you know, we talked about? So I wanted, I want to look at that but I wanted to give you an overview because since we were told, I know we were, that it's, none have, no townships have ever become a city, which stuck here because I said, whoa. that can't possibly be you know what I really don't you know what I remember that though you guys remember I don't I don't want to see because I would put it just it would say something negative about I don't want to do that let's not go there I'll tell you later well I don't know I know did but we but I don't

  29. and there may be, very well may be more than just those things that we're being restricted because we're a township or a township is restricted to. So since we're talking about an open, clean sheet of paper, there may very well be some very good advantages for Bloomfield Township to no longer be a township but become a city. It may not be. It may be awful. It may be just, we may not be able to. But I would believe, in my opinion, that's why I put it, I wanted to put it on our list of the committees, is to investigate that, is to get answers. What would be the difference between the funding for roads if we were a city rather than a township? What about Headley overrides? How does that work with a city rather than a township? What about other things about, you know, we talked about? So I wanted, I want to look at that but I wanted to give you an overview because since we were told, I know we were, that it's, none have, no townships have ever become a city, which stuck here because I said, whoa. that can't possibly be you know what I really don't you know what I remember that though you guys remember I don't I don't want to see because I would put it just it would say something negative about I don't want to do that let's not go there I'll tell you later well I don't know I know did but we but I don't want the township did a study on this back when Dave Payne was a supervisor that was 25 years ago well but I asked someone to dig it up suit let's go back and revisit that and I'll see if I can find the information and we'll send it out to everybody maybe we can refresh we can use that as a starting point and refresh right okay right but a lot of things have changed since then a lot of things we had nice roads so so that maybe that's good information but I a lot of it may just be obsolete just as Public Act 51 which started 1951 where there were three roads and 40 people in Bloomfield Township not really I'm kidding things have changed there were a lot of cows yeah there were 37 families I think we and the original seriously yeah I think there were 31 1951 no no that's from PA 200 years ago okay right but you know in 1951 Bloomfield Township was still farmland it was still very rural it's not anymore so PA 51 sorry we have a deer problem okay I don't want to digress okay yeah all right anyway so I just want to put that out I want you to see it I did the research so you can see some of these things and what's involved and it's it's not an easy

  30. go there I'll tell you later well I don't know I know did but we but I don't want the township did a study on this back when Dave Payne was a supervisor that was 25 years ago well but I asked someone to dig it up suit let's go back and revisit that and I'll see if I can find the information and we'll send it out to everybody maybe we can refresh we can use that as a starting point and refresh right okay right but a lot of things have changed since then a lot of things we had nice roads so so that maybe that's good information but I a lot of it may just be obsolete just as Public Act 51 which started 1951 where there were three roads and 40 people in Bloomfield Township not really I'm kidding things have changed there were a lot of cows yeah there were 37 families I think we and the original seriously yeah I think there were 31 1951 no no that's from PA 200 years ago okay right but you know in 1951 Bloomfield Township was still farmland it was still very rural it's not anymore so PA 51 sorry we have a deer problem okay I don't want to digress okay yeah all right anyway so I just want to put that out I want you to see it I did the research so you can see some of these things and what's involved and it's it's not an easy going to be something all right you know oh that's and it could be some political stuff too I mean look you as a township supervisor or the township supervisor would no longer be a township supervisor there'd be a made it well could be it depends no good or it depends there are cities maybe either with a hard manager manager city manager it's right man okay the treasurer clerk you know there's there's still they're still there elected but you know not elected they're paid jobs in cities it depends on the charter well there's two ways to set it there's a we're called I think it's called a hard or a soft management one where the mayor runs the city every day like a city Detroit like a city or Troy or some other cities or soft the mayor doesn't run the city it runs it directs administration and the city manager runs the city so that's part of it that's political I mean we'd have to get sign on the people who have been elected they might not want to lose their jobs you know anyway could you send us that yes absolutely I will do that

  31. going to be something all right you know oh that's and it could be some political stuff too I mean look you as a township supervisor or the township supervisor would no longer be a township supervisor there'd be a made it well could be it depends no good or it depends there are cities maybe either with a hard manager manager city manager it's right man okay the treasurer clerk you know there's there's still they're still there elected but you know not elected they're paid jobs in cities it depends on the charter well there's two ways to set it there's a we're called I think it's called a hard or a soft management one where the mayor runs the city every day like a city Detroit like a city or Troy or some other cities or soft the mayor doesn't run the city it runs it directs administration and the city manager runs the city so that's part of it that's political I mean we'd have to get sign on the people who have been elected they might not want to lose their jobs you know anyway could you send us that yes absolutely I will do that I would love to see that okay oh Jeff did you sent the pros and cons not the pros and cons okay that's what yes Jeff the kind they put this together. If you want, I can work with Sue and if we can unearth the DAPAIN study, try to follow this model and come up with various ways to look at it. Once I get that from Sue, I'm willing to try to do a first pass at an outlet for a process, how to work through from here to there. And then I'm working on the committee that's on the sheet, you know, on this, and I would like to get some answers. I want to find out from financial people. I want to find out from police. I want to find out from fire. I want to find out from all organizations, how will it see? How would it affect? And again, I'm not advocating this. I'm just thinking we should look at it. Mindy? Wouldn't it also be interesting to know why various entities went through this before?

  32. know anyway could you send us that yes absolutely I will do that I would love to see that okay oh Jeff did you sent the pros and cons not the pros and cons okay that's what yes Jeff the kind they put this together. If you want, I can work with Sue and if we can unearth the DAPAIN study, try to follow this model and come up with various ways to look at it. Once I get that from Sue, I'm willing to try to do a first pass at an outlet for a process, how to work through from here to there. And then I'm working on the committee that's on the sheet, you know, on this, and I would like to get some answers. I want to find out from financial people. I want to find out from police. I want to find out from fire. I want to find out from all organizations, how will it see? How would it affect? And again, I'm not advocating this. I'm just thinking we should look at it. Mindy? Wouldn't it also be interesting to know why various entities went through this before? Well, we can talk to others that have. Right. Just to see. Okay. That's correct. We can do that. My question is really going back and looking at the study that was done previously. I think the value of that study is hopefully it was done based on where the township was sort of economically and politically and whatever. And if it had, if it was, then that study would be valuable, because then that becomes a basis for modeling the changes that have happened over that 25 year period. And then looking, because we look at the pros and cons. But in reality, we need to look at the pros and cons as they apply to this township today. Of course, yeah. Not generically. Of course, yeah. I have this list, and I'm sorry, I thought I did send it, but I guess obviously not. Because, and these are generic, these are pros and cons for a lot of different places. I mean, yeah, they may not apply. One of the cons I know, I know even if it's on here, I have to look at it again, is that you need to have a road department. Now, for most townships throughout the state of Michigan, they don't, and that's expensive, but we do.

  33. Mindy? Wouldn't it also be interesting to know why various entities went through this before? Well, we can talk to others that have. Right. Just to see. Okay. That's correct. We can do that. My question is really going back and looking at the study that was done previously. I think the value of that study is hopefully it was done based on where the township was sort of economically and politically and whatever. And if it had, if it was, then that study would be valuable, because then that becomes a basis for modeling the changes that have happened over that 25 year period. And then looking, because we look at the pros and cons. But in reality, we need to look at the pros and cons as they apply to this township today. Of course, yeah. Not generically. Of course, yeah. I have this list, and I'm sorry, I thought I did send it, but I guess obviously not. Because, and these are generic, these are pros and cons for a lot of different places. I mean, yeah, they may not apply. One of the cons I know, I know even if it's on here, I have to look at it again, is that you need to have a road department. Now, for most townships throughout the state of Michigan, they don't, and that's expensive, but we do. Okay, so that, you know, that con may not apply to us. So, we'll look at that. That's right. Okay, that's great. The, I just, again, I remember we said, we said that we were looking at this whole thing. It was going to be a blank sheet of paper. Any idea? Yeah. And I, yeah, and I really, I think that it's, the time has come. You know, that was, that, when David, that David Payne was here. That was two, well, one, two master plans ago. Another master plan was developed for the township since he left off under Leo Savoy's administration. I was involved in that. that. now in another year or two I think another next year we're gonna look at another master plan starting December of 2026 okay so this year at the end of this year we'll look at it again Jeff Hockman's gonna help us with that okay right well then it comes to the planning it right so that's a second master plan since we looked at that study back then things have changed so yeah okay gray here okay anything anybody else have any that's a pros and cons yes could you

  34. Now, for most townships throughout the state of Michigan, they don't, and that's expensive, but we do. Okay, so that, you know, that con may not apply to us. So, we'll look at that. That's right. Okay, that's great. The, I just, again, I remember we said, we said that we were looking at this whole thing. It was going to be a blank sheet of paper. Any idea? Yeah. And I, yeah, and I really, I think that it's, the time has come. You know, that was, that, when David, that David Payne was here. That was two, well, one, two master plans ago. Another master plan was developed for the township since he left off under Leo Savoy's administration. I was involved in that. that. now in another year or two I think another next year we're gonna look at another master plan starting December of 2026 okay so this year at the end of this year we'll look at it again Jeff Hockman's gonna help us with that okay right well then it comes to the planning it right so that's a second master plan since we looked at that study back then things have changed so yeah okay gray here okay anything anybody else have any that's a pros and cons yes could you share those with Sue so she can yeah you know I thought I did but I haven't yeah I've got it right here I attached it can you put it doesn't matter at this point you can't put that up there now from this can you well it doesn't matter I will send it all right and then we can hand them out people can look at it and my notes are at the bottom that's a quote that's good that's a quote from the law that says about the political party so just leave it on there you know Fred was just talking about Fred so one of the things I was just mentioning is that with this previous study we could actually feed that study into an AI bot and also and also and also have the AI bot outline all the changes that have happened to the township in every type of a category that we want and have it provide some updates to pros and cons now not that we have to listen to it but we can do that it'll have the ability to grab a lot of information the committee level right yeah yeah

  35. here okay anything anybody else have any that's a pros and cons yes could you share those with Sue so she can yeah you know I thought I did but I haven't yeah I've got it right here I attached it can you put it doesn't matter at this point you can't put that up there now from this can you well it doesn't matter I will send it all right and then we can hand them out people can look at it and my notes are at the bottom that's a quote that's good that's a quote from the law that says about the political party so just leave it on there you know Fred was just talking about Fred so one of the things I was just mentioning is that with this previous study we could actually feed that study into an AI bot and also and also and also have the AI bot outline all the changes that have happened to the township in every type of a category that we want and have it provide some updates to pros and cons now not that we have to listen to it but we can do that it'll have the ability to grab a lot of information the committee level right yeah yeah okay anything else on that subject no okay then let's finish that now let's public comment anything today no i mean i'm uh okay encouraged read by your idea my wife has been counting the table on that you know what why do i want to hear that can you come up to there and and i want to hear your comments but it should be done right clay phillips 247 north williamsbury in the village i just want to say fred to your comments about road mitigation and some way of handling that i think i'm going to pass that on to my wife kate because she will send you a nice valentine's day card she's been upset about that for a long long time we've been in the village for 32 years and um with anecdotal evidence it's like a house that's under construction for two years that's the worst part of the road and um and i have no ideas maybe a gross view you

  36. do that it'll have the ability to grab a lot of information the committee level right yeah yeah okay anything else on that subject no okay then let's finish that now let's public comment anything today no i mean i'm uh okay encouraged read by your idea my wife has been counting the table on that you know what why do i want to hear that can you come up to there and and i want to hear your comments but it should be done right clay phillips 247 north williamsbury in the village i just want to say fred to your comments about road mitigation and some way of handling that i think i'm going to pass that on to my wife kate because she will send you a nice valentine's day card she's been upset about that for a long long time we've been in the village for 32 years and um with anecdotal evidence it's like a house that's under construction for two years that's the worst part of the road and um and i have no ideas maybe a gross view you a weight limit would be an easy way to keep it out. But I think I'd also suggest that whoever's working on that is think also about who's going to be the saboteur on that idea, who's going to object to it. I could think realtors aren't going to be real happy with it. Construction crews aren't going to be happy with it. It's going to add cost to somebody or some chain. And so it would just need to be, well, what's the public good and what's the private hit? And is that fair? I thought, Fred, if someone's putting a $3 million house in and you're paying an extra $10,000 for fees or permits or something, it probably is a rounding error and not going to be a big deal. But you never know. Some of these organizations and associations can be pretty loud and powerful. But then what are you going to do with the $10,000? Yeah, I was just going to say, what's $10,000? What's $10,000? Yeah, but that's the point. That's the point I was trying to make. It's hard to go through that and get it to where it needs to be spent because that $10,000 is not going to do. Okay, we'll put it to just the mitigation or the prevention idea. If you're limiting the weight of vehicles that can come into a community. Yeah, and then you absolutely can do that and I think we do it now.

  37. a weight limit would be an easy way to keep it out. But I think I'd also suggest that whoever's working on that is think also about who's going to be the saboteur on that idea, who's going to object to it. I could think realtors aren't going to be real happy with it. Construction crews aren't going to be happy with it. It's going to add cost to somebody or some chain. And so it would just need to be, well, what's the public good and what's the private hit? And is that fair? I thought, Fred, if someone's putting a $3 million house in and you're paying an extra $10,000 for fees or permits or something, it probably is a rounding error and not going to be a big deal. But you never know. Some of these organizations and associations can be pretty loud and powerful. But then what are you going to do with the $10,000? Yeah, I was just going to say, what's $10,000? What's $10,000? Yeah, but that's the point. That's the point I was trying to make. It's hard to go through that and get it to where it needs to be spent because that $10,000 is not going to do. Okay, we'll put it to just the mitigation or the prevention idea. If you're limiting the weight of vehicles that can come into a community. Yeah, and then you absolutely can do that and I think we do it now. No, there's no limit on trucks going through the township. I checked that. There's no scales. They told us when we were- There's no scales. There's no scales to check the limit if there was one. There is no limit. Yeah. You could say- Perhaps no class 7s, no class 8s, you're limited to class 5s. Yeah, exactly. So there's, at least that would help, at least that would help. And then make exceptions for fire and snow. I know that $10,000 was just a toss out. But at a million dollars a mile in 2025, it's going to be, we heard about 7% increase. It's going to be a significant cost. $10,000 doesn't, covers a couple of potholes to, you know, look. I applaud adding it to the list. I think that's fantastic. And we'll look at that. It's a very good idea, and I hope you come up with some creative ideas that are workable and sellable to the people that are inevitably going to work back in. I just feel, you know, those numbers that were thrown out are just off the top of your head type of things. But I think the reality is, is that the alternative to doing nothing in that category is passing the entire bill on to the homeowners.

  38. No, there's no limit on trucks going through the township. I checked that. There's no scales. They told us when we were- There's no scales. There's no scales to check the limit if there was one. There is no limit. Yeah. You could say- Perhaps no class 7s, no class 8s, you're limited to class 5s. Yeah, exactly. So there's, at least that would help, at least that would help. And then make exceptions for fire and snow. I know that $10,000 was just a toss out. But at a million dollars a mile in 2025, it's going to be, we heard about 7% increase. It's going to be a significant cost. $10,000 doesn't, covers a couple of potholes to, you know, look. I applaud adding it to the list. I think that's fantastic. And we'll look at that. It's a very good idea, and I hope you come up with some creative ideas that are workable and sellable to the people that are inevitably going to work back in. I just feel, you know, those numbers that were thrown out are just off the top of your head type of things. But I think the reality is, is that the alternative to doing nothing in that category is passing the entire bill on to the homeowners. And that's the part that I don't like, and that's the part that my neighbors don't like. And it sounds like it's the part your wife doesn't like either. Well, you know, even that number that you threw out, $10,000, because that's just an arbitrary number that you just threw out. But you know, if you build 50 homes a year, times $10,000 each, and that money goes into the road department, that's a significant amount of money to do something with. Right. It's not nothing. There's a prevention and there's a revenue side to the equation that we have to get . Well, of course, yeah. It's all got to be looked at thoroughly. Good. Thank you. I came here to say something nice. Appreciate it. Good idea. That's refreshing. No. Come on. Okay. Question. Yeah. Go. This is provost. Do you have a page with cons? You know, I have to go look. I thought I'd... It's on the other side. Son of a gun. It's on the back side. Here it is. Sorry. I thought I saw the white was a good idea. Oh, man. No. It's there. It was intentional. It's nothing. Sorry. So need your steps.

  39. But I think the reality is, is that the alternative to doing nothing in that category is passing the entire bill on to the homeowners. And that's the part that I don't like, and that's the part that my neighbors don't like. And it sounds like it's the part your wife doesn't like either. Well, you know, even that number that you threw out, $10,000, because that's just an arbitrary number that you just threw out. But you know, if you build 50 homes a year, times $10,000 each, and that money goes into the road department, that's a significant amount of money to do something with. Right. It's not nothing. There's a prevention and there's a revenue side to the equation that we have to get . Well, of course, yeah. It's all got to be looked at thoroughly. Good. Thank you. I came here to say something nice. Appreciate it. Good idea. That's refreshing. No. Come on. Okay. Question. Yeah. Go. This is provost. Do you have a page with cons? You know, I have to go look. I thought I'd... It's on the other side. Son of a gun. It's on the back side. Here it is. Sorry. I thought I saw the white was a good idea. Oh, man. No. It's there. It was intentional. It's nothing. Sorry. So need your steps. All right. So, any items that are not on the agenda that you think something you want to add? Mindy. Mindy. So, and Clay, you're in the same section we live in in the Village. I'd like to hear from Mr. McCready about his sense of what the meeting will involve on Monday evening about the last section. The green section? Uh-huh. We're just holding the public hearing. Maybe everyone here should know since you're the meeting. Well, we'll post the agenda tomorrow afternoon. Yeah. And that's a public hearing on the SAD for the green section. Right. So residents will come and see. their opinion on it. That's a hearing of necessity right? Yes. Is it necessary to do it? Well that's what a hearing necessity is for, right? Yes, I'm trying to think of the wording. I can't think of the wording right now. That was it? Yeah. Hearing of necessity. And we did it on yours as well, the gold and the yellow section. Right, so I'm here to share some thoughts before that meeting. Okay. So are you all familiar with what we're talking about? No, they're not. No, they're not. No, I'm not. Right, so if you could, I mean I don't want to speak out of turn about what the

  40. All right. So, any items that are not on the agenda that you think something you want to add? Mindy. Mindy. So, and Clay, you're in the same section we live in in the Village. I'd like to hear from Mr. McCready about his sense of what the meeting will involve on Monday evening about the last section. The green section? Uh-huh. We're just holding the public hearing. Maybe everyone here should know since you're the meeting. Well, we'll post the agenda tomorrow afternoon. Yeah. And that's a public hearing on the SAD for the green section. Right. So residents will come and see. their opinion on it. That's a hearing of necessity right? Yes. Is it necessary to do it? Well that's what a hearing necessity is for, right? Yes, I'm trying to think of the wording. I can't think of the wording right now. That was it? Yeah. Hearing of necessity. And we did it on yours as well, the gold and the yellow section. Right, so I'm here to share some thoughts before that meeting. Okay. So are you all familiar with what we're talking about? No, they're not. No, they're not. No, I'm not. Right, so if you could, I mean I don't want to speak out of turn about what the process. No, I'm not the HOA manager and I don't work for the township. I would prefer someone else. Explain what, how we're in this, where we are with this process, Mike. Where we are with the village process? Right. Well this is the last section. Right. That we divided up into five sections. There was the first, the red and the blue, and we're still cleaning up the red and the blue. We're close, I know. There's still a little bit of punch list and then I think they're finally working on the numbers with the Road Commission about what money is left that we could issue credits to homeowners or refunds depending on if you're paying for it over a period of time or if you paid for it all up front. And I know they're inching closer to that. And then the yellow, the yellow and the gold section, they're going to come back in the spring and they've got areas marked off to where they got to go back and fix some of the paving that was done. I know there some errors in the concrete I believe it was where the asphalt didn't it doesn't adhere correctly and don't I'm not a not a road engineer and then there's and

  41. Right, so if you could, I mean I don't want to speak out of turn about what the process. No, I'm not the HOA manager and I don't work for the township. I would prefer someone else. Explain what, how we're in this, where we are with this process, Mike. Where we are with the village process? Right. Well this is the last section. Right. That we divided up into five sections. There was the first, the red and the blue, and we're still cleaning up the red and the blue. We're close, I know. There's still a little bit of punch list and then I think they're finally working on the numbers with the Road Commission about what money is left that we could issue credits to homeowners or refunds depending on if you're paying for it over a period of time or if you paid for it all up front. And I know they're inching closer to that. And then the yellow, the yellow and the gold section, they're going to come back in the spring and they've got areas marked off to where they got to go back and fix some of the paving that was done. I know there some errors in the concrete I believe it was where the asphalt didn't it doesn't adhere correctly and don't I'm not a not a road engineer and then there's and then there's some lot of road lawn repairs and sprinkler repairs I know to get done and then the green section and then the green section will have the hearing on Monday night hear from the residents and then vote to move forward if if everybody's in agreement there's more you have the hearing a necessity then you have to have a hearing another hearing of who's in inclusion into the the makeup of the of the assessment district right okay I cut me off yeah that's right right yeah but they they've turned in their petitions they had enough to move forward so we're going through that process right so because our meetings are at 430 which is fine when people can make this a lot of the community this clay Phillips that lives around the corner from us can't come and these meetings right because they're actively working people and they can't leave their professions to come and so they communicate with me and I think part of my role but you should tell me in front of us fine is to share what people say you you

  42. adhere correctly and don't I'm not a not a road engineer and then there's and then there's some lot of road lawn repairs and sprinkler repairs I know to get done and then the green section and then the green section will have the hearing on Monday night hear from the residents and then vote to move forward if if everybody's in agreement there's more you have the hearing a necessity then you have to have a hearing another hearing of who's in inclusion into the the makeup of the of the assessment district right okay I cut me off yeah that's right right yeah but they they've turned in their petitions they had enough to move forward so we're going through that process right so because our meetings are at 430 which is fine when people can make this a lot of the community this clay Phillips that lives around the corner from us can't come and these meetings right because they're actively working people and they can't leave their professions to come and so they communicate with me and I think part of my role but you should tell me in front of us fine is to share what people say you you not here is that true is that accurate well I think if it involves what the purpose here is to help figure out roads going forward they can also send in written that will go in our minutes and we encourage people to do that and if there is it about the green section well so they can come to the meeting on Monday night our meeting starts at 630 and that's pretty much our main topic for the meeting on Monday so they could come Monday and express their thoughts about that Monday night so I'll just say one thing not all of it the greatest frustration with the process is that the process itself has doesn't have a lot of integrity from the residents perspective the HOA which is called Bloomfield villages HOA right that's what I'm speaking about had an open-ended petition signature gathering process and the amount of signatures that were needed to approve the fifth section which is called green we're not garnered before the end

  43. not here is that true is that accurate well I think if it involves what the purpose here is to help figure out roads going forward they can also send in written that will go in our minutes and we encourage people to do that and if there is it about the green section well so they can come to the meeting on Monday night our meeting starts at 630 and that's pretty much our main topic for the meeting on Monday so they could come Monday and express their thoughts about that Monday night so I'll just say one thing not all of it the greatest frustration with the process is that the process itself has doesn't have a lot of integrity from the residents perspective the HOA which is called Bloomfield villages HOA right that's what I'm speaking about had an open-ended petition signature gathering process and the amount of signatures that were needed to approve the fifth section which is called green we're not garnered before the end of the year the end of the calendar year it's just a comment for the other sections with a lot of process challenges too were obtained at least a month earlier the residents in the green section than their belief system was, we will have a chance to redesign the way the last section is done. To save money, to have a better process, and more than those things, to take lessons learned from the first four sections and do something differently for the last section. Not to not fix the roads, that's why we're all here, right, we want the roads to be. And so, surprisingly so then, the communication that came out in the media and other about funding that was identified to then encourage people to sign the petition, although the funding is not material from a financial perspective, then that information was used to pressure the residents of the green section to sign, to garner enough petition signatures to be over the 50% threshold. I don't know what you understand from the HOA manager, I'm not representing that person, I haven't communicated with her.

  44. approve the fifth section which is called green we're not garnered before the end of the year the end of the calendar year it's just a comment for the other sections with a lot of process challenges too were obtained at least a month earlier the residents in the green section than their belief system was, we will have a chance to redesign the way the last section is done. To save money, to have a better process, and more than those things, to take lessons learned from the first four sections and do something differently for the last section. Not to not fix the roads, that's why we're all here, right, we want the roads to be. And so, surprisingly so then, the communication that came out in the media and other about funding that was identified to then encourage people to sign the petition, although the funding is not material from a financial perspective, then that information was used to pressure the residents of the green section to sign, to garner enough petition signatures to be over the 50% threshold. I don't know what you understand from the HOA manager, I'm not representing that person, I haven't communicated with her. And so there's a tremendous amount of dissatisfaction with not being able to have a voice, to redesign the fifth section with lessons learned, and a lot of frustration with monies being identified that weren't identified before anywhere in any of the other processes, I realize there may be a reason for that, I don't know. But then to find additional monies, or money at all, and have the HOA manager, I don't know manager and other members of the board be very verbally aggressive with residents of the fifth section to convince them to place their name on a petition or otherwise they were not wealthy enough to quote live in Bloomfield Village it's met with a lot of frustration so you will hear enough said I just don't want you to be surprised right the meetings in a few days but that is the sum and substance of kind of how and I don't want to put Clay Phillips well and that will be you know that's why those hearings are held right so they can come and discuss I haven't heard from a resident in the village of being forced or I'm sorry the term you used to sign a petition was what did you

  45. I haven't communicated with her. And so there's a tremendous amount of dissatisfaction with not being able to have a voice, to redesign the fifth section with lessons learned, and a lot of frustration with monies being identified that weren't identified before anywhere in any of the other processes, I realize there may be a reason for that, I don't know. But then to find additional monies, or money at all, and have the HOA manager, I don't know manager and other members of the board be very verbally aggressive with residents of the fifth section to convince them to place their name on a petition or otherwise they were not wealthy enough to quote live in Bloomfield Village it's met with a lot of frustration so you will hear enough said I just don't want you to be surprised right the meetings in a few days but that is the sum and substance of kind of how and I don't want to put Clay Phillips well and that will be you know that's why those hearings are held right so they can come and discuss I haven't heard from a resident in the village of being forced or I'm sorry the term you used to sign a petition was what did you say coerced yeah I've not heard from any resident of that nature and and then you were talking about the financing side of it yeah you were talking about the assistance the Road Commission came in and put into the green section right the extra money that they received the Road Commission yeah the Road Commission did that and that is money that they knew were planning on coming from the state so as I've stated and they stated they want to participate in SADs going forward and so this was money that they felt was going to get allocated from the state that they could feel comfortable coming to and if we all follow the timeline on the state budget and we've talked about this and so when the budget It was approved and signed into law by Governor Whitmer, I believe it was on October 3rd, that Wednesday? I think so. Yeah, which now, and that budget went into effect, they said, we're going to try and put more money into this section. And I think that was the most expensive section. It's not the most expensive section. It is not. Ten million? Ours is. How much was your total? Fifty. Fifty-five thousand. Okay, but total for the yellow and gold total, how much was it?

  46. being forced or I'm sorry the term you used to sign a petition was what did you say coerced yeah I've not heard from any resident of that nature and and then you were talking about the financing side of it yeah you were talking about the assistance the Road Commission came in and put into the green section right the extra money that they received the Road Commission yeah the Road Commission did that and that is money that they knew were planning on coming from the state so as I've stated and they stated they want to participate in SADs going forward and so this was money that they felt was going to get allocated from the state that they could feel comfortable coming to and if we all follow the timeline on the state budget and we've talked about this and so when the budget It was approved and signed into law by Governor Whitmer, I believe it was on October 3rd, that Wednesday? I think so. Yeah, which now, and that budget went into effect, they said, we're going to try and put more money into this section. And I think that was the most expensive section. It's not the most expensive section. It is not. Ten million? Ours is. How much was your total? Fifty. Fifty-five thousand. Okay, but total for the yellow and gold total, how much was it? Six, eight million? We don't know, Mike, off the top of our heads. Yeah, and it's divided up by households. And I don't know the exact number either, but I believe the green section was north of nine million? I don't know. And then they have more homes, and they're dealing with Bradway Boulevard. So the road commission came to the table and put in, gave us a credit on the design and engineering fees, I think, for the green section of $500,000. And then they came in and put another $500,000 towards the SAD. When I first came into office, this yellow and gold section, which you are in, came up. And we went to the road commission to ask for some assistance because of the cost. And they put in, they gave $500,000 in credit of design and engineering for the gold section. And so we were able to get a little extra money, or they came to the table with some extra money. for the green section after the state budget was approved which added two billion dollars to road funding of which there was a certain number that went to our Road Commission I think the increase was I think 35% is that wasn't that right they went from a hundred and ten million up and add 35% to it and the

  47. Okay, but total for the yellow and gold total, how much was it? Six, eight million? We don't know, Mike, off the top of our heads. Yeah, and it's divided up by households. And I don't know the exact number either, but I believe the green section was north of nine million? I don't know. And then they have more homes, and they're dealing with Bradway Boulevard. So the road commission came to the table and put in, gave us a credit on the design and engineering fees, I think, for the green section of $500,000. And then they came in and put another $500,000 towards the SAD. When I first came into office, this yellow and gold section, which you are in, came up. And we went to the road commission to ask for some assistance because of the cost. And they put in, they gave $500,000 in credit of design and engineering for the gold section. And so we were able to get a little extra money, or they came to the table with some extra money. for the green section after the state budget was approved which added two billion dollars to road funding of which there was a certain number that went to our Road Commission I think the increase was I think 35% is that wasn't that right they went from a hundred and ten million up and add 35% to it and the thought and Gary I think talked to us when we was here said we're gonna try it we want to participate more with these SADs and that's what they did well the last meeting when Casey Christensen was here and clay was here before and they spoke you guys heard their sentiments I don't want to put clay on the spot but I mean the cause and effect and the commentary I'm quoting people that had these conversations so I'm just my I view part of my role is to share representing the community I take it very seriously or I wouldn't be here and so I think it's a should not be opaque from the residents to you nor should it be opaque obviously the other way and we need a better process going forward because it's been terribly dissatisfying as you know because we met before you we've known each other well I think there's divided the community there and very strongly and I think we this is a I they have to come to the meeting on Monday and express their thoughts that's the best thing they can do yeah well hopefully they will I don't know yeah I'll encourage they should because this is a lot of money well that's

  48. right they went from a hundred and ten million up and add 35% to it and the thought and Gary I think talked to us when we was here said we're gonna try it we want to participate more with these SADs and that's what they did well the last meeting when Casey Christensen was here and clay was here before and they spoke you guys heard their sentiments I don't want to put clay on the spot but I mean the cause and effect and the commentary I'm quoting people that had these conversations so I'm just my I view part of my role is to share representing the community I take it very seriously or I wouldn't be here and so I think it's a should not be opaque from the residents to you nor should it be opaque obviously the other way and we need a better process going forward because it's been terribly dissatisfying as you know because we met before you we've known each other well I think there's divided the community there and very strongly and I think we this is a I they have to come to the meeting on Monday and express their thoughts that's the best thing they can do yeah well hopefully they will I don't know yeah I'll encourage they should because this is a lot of money well that's thing it's fit right thousand fifty thousand plus interest right for in front of our home 75 feet of frontage right well in any community in the United States that is extraordinarily expensive it's not just our I'm just using our math oh it's yeah well you know what and that and the person across the streets paying the same thing it's a hundred and forty K strip right for the strip in front of our home it's a hundred and forty thousand dollars right that's not logical at all I would say all right in any business thank you for listening I felt I should share because I asked thank you thank you that's all right anybody have anything else that's on the agenda then we need to motion to adjourn well I sorry a real quick thing I'm sorry didn't jump in it I know no no no I know it's this is a guy this is not communism I spent quite a bit of time listening to what the world is the local world is doing about the deer population why it is what it isn't and we're in the process of getting a copy of the presentation that was given to us that I want to I'll share with everyone Susan and I were both on the and just and I sent that note to everyone that said

  49. thing it's fit right thousand fifty thousand plus interest right for in front of our home 75 feet of frontage right well in any community in the United States that is extraordinarily expensive it's not just our I'm just using our math oh it's yeah well you know what and that and the person across the streets paying the same thing it's a hundred and forty K strip right for the strip in front of our home it's a hundred and forty thousand dollars right that's not logical at all I would say all right in any business thank you for listening I felt I should share because I asked thank you thank you that's all right anybody have anything else that's on the agenda then we need to motion to adjourn well I sorry a real quick thing I'm sorry didn't jump in it I know no no no I know it's this is a guy this is not communism I spent quite a bit of time listening to what the world is the local world is doing about the deer population why it is what it isn't and we're in the process of getting a copy of the presentation that was given to us that I want to I'll share with everyone Susan and I were both on the and just and I sent that note to everyone that said that the three people were three people three townships or cities we're going to call the herd this fall and they're going through with it And I'm not saying, and so, but it was done by the University of Michigan, they have way more input into this than was, you know, I was led to believe, and they did a nice job. So that's kind of where we are with it, and anything after that, I mean, we could have a discussion, but it's really going to take money. You're going to have to hire a biologist of which other townships and cities will share the biologist with you if you want to go down that avenue. But I would say, based upon the statistics that you'll see from this, you know, when we get a copy of the thing, it's a real, culling the herd is, you know, that's the thing everybody's going to latch on to, but the whole management thing is important and probably something that the township will have to pay for. As well as, perhaps, you know, people have said, do we have a problem? No, and I think by any stretch of the imagination, we have a problem.

  50. Susan and I were both on the and just and I sent that note to everyone that said that the three people were three people three townships or cities we're going to call the herd this fall and they're going through with it And I'm not saying, and so, but it was done by the University of Michigan, they have way more input into this than was, you know, I was led to believe, and they did a nice job. So that's kind of where we are with it, and anything after that, I mean, we could have a discussion, but it's really going to take money. You're going to have to hire a biologist of which other townships and cities will share the biologist with you if you want to go down that avenue. But I would say, based upon the statistics that you'll see from this, you know, when we get a copy of the thing, it's a real, culling the herd is, you know, that's the thing everybody's going to latch on to, but the whole management thing is important and probably something that the township will have to pay for. As well as, perhaps, you know, people have said, do we have a problem? No, and I think by any stretch of the imagination, we have a problem. What's your documentation for that? No, they have the documentation. No, we don't in Bloomfield Township. They did it in Southfield, and they did in Franklin, not Franklin, Southfield and... Well, Bloomfield Township is not, you know, if we were a city, we would probably have the statistics, but we don't have them. They have to hire drones to get our documentation. Okay, anyway, that's for the... I just thought I'd report to people that we did that. Anything else? All right. We had the motion to adjourn, and we're adjourned. We're adjourned. Thank you all very much. Good meeting. Thank you. Thank you.