Bloomfield Township Design Review Board Meeting on April 1, 2026

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Transcript

Click any timestamp to jump the video to that moment. Auto-transcribed; expect occasional errors on proper nouns.

1. 0:00

   The design review board on April the 1st, Wednesday, April the 1st, we'll take attendance. Looks like we're all here. All here. Wonderful. Thanks for joining us there, Neil. And I'll open up for public comment. If you're here to comment an item on the agenda, you can come to the podium and ask you to keep it at three minutes. You introduce yourself and your address. We'd appreciate it. And if there's no public comment, we'll close public comment and ask for approval of the minutes from our March 18, 2026 meeting. So moved. Support. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Passes three to nothing. Thank you. Item number four, new item, signs for Culver's Restaurant, 1801 South Telegraph Road. Tom. Good afternoon, board. First item on the agenda is for the signage package for the proposed Culver's Restaurant and Telegraph Road. This proposed business is located in the Township's B3 General Business District and is surrounded by other business and light manufacturing properties. So earlier in the year, they came with their site plan as part of the motion. They had to return to the DRB for their signage package. This is what we're going to be looking at today. The first item I'll discuss is their monument sign, which will be located right here along Telegraph Road, 25 feet from the right-of-way. This is what it will look like. It meets the township ordinances by being 25 square feet, well within the required allotment, and it will not have any... flashing intermittent or moving illumination and no exposed neon lighting. When it comes to the wall signs, we'll be looking at six signs that they're proposing on the building. Together, they will total 160 square feet, which exceeds the limit of 120 square feet. And when it comes to the lighting along the parapets, that will be accent strip lighting that is not downward shielded, so we asked the sign company to remove that, and they agreed. But when it comes to other components of the township's ordinances, it will be five and a half inches projecting out from the building, which meets the requirement of not being more than 12 inches projecting away from the building. They are going to make an application to the ZBA, which they have done, for the seven signs total.

2. 1:15

   The first item I'll discuss is their monument sign, which will be located right here along Telegraph Road, 25 feet from the right-of-way. This is what it will look like. It meets the township ordinances by being 25 square feet, well within the required allotment, and it will not have any... flashing intermittent or moving illumination and no exposed neon lighting. When it comes to the wall signs, we'll be looking at six signs that they're proposing on the building. Together, they will total 160 square feet, which exceeds the limit of 120 square feet. And when it comes to the lighting along the parapets, that will be accent strip lighting that is not downward shielded, so we asked the sign company to remove that, and they agreed. But when it comes to other components of the township's ordinances, it will be five and a half inches projecting out from the building, which meets the requirement of not being more than 12 inches projecting away from the building. They are going to make an application to the ZBA, which they have done, for the seven signs total. And when it comes to lighting, there will be no flashing, no neon lighting, and the other item is that on the main and front elevations, the sign, part of it exceeds the, or is higher than the roof line. That is another variance that they're going to be going to the ZBA for. With that, I'm happy to answer any questions. And we do have the... applicants here today so the sign otherwise the ground sign meets ordinance yes and building sign is needs a variance for being the second sign they need a variance for the they're only allowed one sign so they're going to have seven total including the monuments so they're going to variance for that okay they're going to need a variance because two of the wall signs are going to be slightly above the roof line and then when you combine all the wall signs together it exceeds 120 square feet they're proposing 160 so that's a variance and let's see if i'm missing anything else is it common for us to have seven signs uh i haven't seen it in my time of the planning department

3. 2:30

   for the seven signs total. And when it comes to lighting, there will be no flashing, no neon lighting, and the other item is that on the main and front elevations, the sign, part of it exceeds the, or is higher than the roof line. That is another variance that they're going to be going to the ZBA for. With that, I'm happy to answer any questions. And we do have the... applicants here today so the sign otherwise the ground sign meets ordinance yes and building sign is needs a variance for being the second sign they need a variance for the they're only allowed one sign so they're going to have seven total including the monuments so they're going to variance for that okay they're going to need a variance because two of the wall signs are going to be slightly above the roof line and then when you combine all the wall signs together it exceeds 120 square feet they're proposing 160 so that's a variance and let's see if i'm missing anything else is it common for us to have seven signs uh i haven't seen it in my time of the planning department when it comes to the rear elevation sign we were iterated to the applicant that that probably should be removed since it's facing a parking lot but when they made application to the zba they wanted to include it okay but those signs meet the design yes they're they're allowed no more than 47 square feet and all signs either meets or are below that square footage no i mean the monument signs attractive I understand the second sign. I certainly understand why it needs to go to the ZVA. I think that's seven signs. I've never seen it in all my years on the board or on the Design Review Board or the Planning Commission, any of the boards, that many signs being presented. Joe, is this a package that when you are Culver, can you come up here for a minute? Or you're a representative from PEA. I'll show you my heart. Yeah, Jim, from PEA. I'll go over there. Okay.

4. 3:45

   is it common for us to have seven signs uh i haven't seen it in my time of the planning department when it comes to the rear elevation sign we were iterated to the applicant that that probably should be removed since it's facing a parking lot but when they made application to the zba they wanted to include it okay but those signs meet the design yes they're they're allowed no more than 47 square feet and all signs either meets or are below that square footage no i mean the monument signs attractive I understand the second sign. I certainly understand why it needs to go to the ZVA. I think that's seven signs. I've never seen it in all my years on the board or on the Design Review Board or the Planning Commission, any of the boards, that many signs being presented. Joe, is this a package that when you are Culver, can you come up here for a minute? Or you're a representative from PEA. I'll show you my heart. Yeah, Jim, from PEA. I'll go over there. Okay. If you can't do it, Joe. You're paying the bill. All right. You guys are paying them. You're fine. So I guess my question is, so you're a franchisee of Culver's, and Culver's probably has a package, right, of how they want the building and everything to look. Are seven signs typical for all the Culver's stores? Well, basically the Bonny Road sign is, I think you're okay with that one. Normally we have four signs, all those signs, on each side of the four buildings. Okay. And the other two signs, how was it? The one is the custer and the border, the border and the lower one. So that one there. So that's what you're... And, yeah, so this is pretty much a prototype of the signs that are required or requested by the commission, or by corporate, I mean. Yeah. And your Lake Orion store, how many signs do you have on Lake Orion? how many signs do you have on Lake Orion? This one you'll notice there's both of you. And an example, There's your picture, Well, we have two stores in Lake Cori. The most recent one, we have a sign on each side, four signs. Okay. And then we have the monument sign. And the same one on Lapeer Road there? Lapeer Road, we have two there, Mike. Just two?

5. 5:00

   If you can't do it, Joe. You're paying the bill. All right. You guys are paying them. You're fine. So I guess my question is, so you're a franchisee of Culver's, and Culver's probably has a package, right, of how they want the building and everything to look. Are seven signs typical for all the Culver's stores? Well, basically the Bonny Road sign is, I think you're okay with that one. Normally we have four signs, all those signs, on each side of the four buildings. Okay. And the other two signs, how was it? The one is the custer and the border, the border and the lower one. So that one there. So that's what you're... And, yeah, so this is pretty much a prototype of the signs that are required or requested by the commission, or by corporate, I mean. Yeah. And your Lake Orion store, how many signs do you have on Lake Orion? how many signs do you have on Lake Orion? This one you'll notice there's both of you. And an example, There's your picture, Well, we have two stores in Lake Cori. The most recent one, we have a sign on each side, four signs. Okay. And then we have the monument sign. And the same one on Lapeer Road there? Lapeer Road, we have two there, Mike. Just two? Yeah. Was the monument sign and then one on the building or two on the building? Two on the building. One on the front of the building and the other one facing Lapeer. So where are the seven signs? I only see five. So we have one, two, three, four, five, six, seven. Oh, okay. So I was under the impression that there were only five, but the one monument where on the sides, one on each side, which would be four. Okay. Plus the monument sign, it would be five. Plus the better burgers. And then what's that other sixth sign, Tom? This one, it's, when I called the sign company, they described it as like a smaller version of the Culver sign. Is it on the door? Where is it? Is it under a window or what is that? Okay. Okay. Okay. I wasn't aware of that one, but that is, it's a, it's a side that says butter burgers I had. You know, it's just, it's basically about this size, three feet. Well, it's been.

6. 6:15

   Yeah. Was the monument sign and then one on the building or two on the building? Two on the building. One on the front of the building and the other one facing Lapeer. So where are the seven signs? I only see five. So we have one, two, three, four, five, six, seven. Oh, okay. So I was under the impression that there were only five, but the one monument where on the sides, one on each side, which would be four. Okay. Plus the monument sign, it would be five. Plus the better burgers. And then what's that other sixth sign, Tom? This one, it's, when I called the sign company, they described it as like a smaller version of the Culver sign. Is it on the door? Where is it? Is it under a window or what is that? Okay. Okay. Okay. I wasn't aware of that one, but that is, it's a, it's a side that says butter burgers I had. You know, it's just, it's basically about this size, three feet. Well, it's been. maybe 18 inches, and it's a white sign with blue lettering. Okay. So all the signs that are on this building is what corporate's asking you to do? Correct, yes. That is correct. Well, we don't really deal with variances for the number of signs, right? Right, right. So from a design perspective, I guess I'm okay with them. So I would make a motion that we approve the signs as presented and forward. Well, we approve the signs, and we forward the request for variances to the Zoning Board of Appeal with our strong reservations. Support. Okay. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Okay, pass 3-0. Good luck. Thank you, gentlemen. Good to see you again. Appreciate it. Thank you. Okay. Site improvements, 7400 Telegraph Road, Temple Bethel. Tom? Yes. The next item before us is for Temple Bethel on Telegraph Road. Temple's located in our R1 district, surrounded by other residential properties, and today they

7. 7:30

   maybe 18 inches, and it's a white sign with blue lettering. Okay. So all the signs that are on this building is what corporate's asking you to do? Correct, yes. That is correct. Well, we don't really deal with variances for the number of signs, right? Right, right. So from a design perspective, I guess I'm okay with them. So I would make a motion that we approve the signs as presented and forward. Well, we approve the signs, and we forward the request for variances to the Zoning Board of Appeal with our strong reservations. Support. Okay. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Okay, pass 3-0. Good luck. Thank you, gentlemen. Good to see you again. Appreciate it. Thank you. Okay. Site improvements, 7400 Telegraph Road, Temple Bethel. Tom? Yes. The next item before us is for Temple Bethel on Telegraph Road. Temple's located in our R1 district, surrounded by other residential properties, and today they are looking to install some gates along their Telegraph Road driveways. And it's going to be two types of gates. One's going to be a swing gate, and then the other one will be... It's going to be the first door. It's going to be holding the사� this barrier gate they were routed to the police and fire departments and police had no concerns and the fire department iterated that with this driveway in particular the fire code requires that the driveway be 20 feet they recognize that it's 19.5 feet wide and that when the gate is installed it can't restrict that access any further and that it be equipped with emergency capabilities like you know consensus fire truck approaching and the gate can lift automatically that it can be powered if you know electricity gets lost and what we these concerns were iterated to the gate contractor they had no problems with satisfying those requirements and today we have melanie from the temple who can answer any other questions but this is

8. 8:45

   Temple's located in our R1 district, surrounded by other residential properties, and today they are looking to install some gates along their Telegraph Road driveways. And it's going to be two types of gates. One's going to be a swing gate, and then the other one will be... It's going to be the first door. It's going to be holding the사� this barrier gate they were routed to the police and fire departments and police had no concerns and the fire department iterated that with this driveway in particular the fire code requires that the driveway be 20 feet they recognize that it's 19.5 feet wide and that when the gate is installed it can't restrict that access any further and that it be equipped with emergency capabilities like you know consensus fire truck approaching and the gate can lift automatically that it can be powered if you know electricity gets lost and what we these concerns were iterated to the gate contractor they had no problems with satisfying those requirements and today we have melanie from the temple who can answer any other questions but this is purely a security measure to protect the congregants especially in light of what has happened recently i have no concerns other than i certainly understand the need for the the gates and certainly considering what just happened in temple israel and certainly very supportive of the need for any type of security measures I would in support of like a motion that we approve. Can I just ask a question? Is there gonna be a gate on the 14 mile entrance? At some point, there isn't now. There isn't now. I don't believe one was proposed. Maybe you can come up here, Melanie, and answer that. Thank you for having me. Currently, we're not proposing that in the future. We're looking to possibly do a gatehouse, but at this time, we have security during business hours for our ECC students and staff at that entrance. Then I'll second his motion.

9. 10:00

   we have melanie from the temple who can answer any other questions but this is purely a security measure to protect the congregants especially in light of what has happened recently i have no concerns other than i certainly understand the need for the the gates and certainly considering what just happened in temple israel and certainly very supportive of the need for any type of security measures I would in support of like a motion that we approve. Can I just ask a question? Is there gonna be a gate on the 14 mile entrance? At some point, there isn't now. There isn't now. I don't believe one was proposed. Maybe you can come up here, Melanie, and answer that. Thank you for having me. Currently, we're not proposing that in the future. We're looking to possibly do a gatehouse, but at this time, we have security during business hours for our ECC students and staff at that entrance. Then I'll second his motion. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Passes three to nothing. Thank you. Thank you. Item number two, 1200 Lone Pine Road, the Hills of Lone Pine, and various addresses, Tom. Yes. So today, we're gonna be looking at an extension of the fence proposal, which has previously come before the DRB and the ZBA for the Hills of Lone Pine. I think it was earlier in January. The Hills came to the DRB to install some signage in the common areas that they have along their perimeter, and some neighboring property owners liked the fence and requested that the fence be installed on their property. So this was the plan submitted in December. where it is. Let's go,lei, and let's go see what's going on. When we remember the middle and嘉ley a terminal time vy Thank you. is what we're considering today and it's going to be a six foot high rail fence similar to what was installed previously and it'll need to go to the zoning board of appeals for exceeding exceeding the four foot height limits and they have made application for that and they'll proceed if approved today so they're cleaning up some of their fences that are there they're going to get rid of some of the chicken wire fences they have they're going to get rid of the chicken wire and this all started by with an assessment that they asked the bloomfield township police departments

10. 11:15

    Then I'll second his motion. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Passes three to nothing. Thank you. Thank you. Item number two, 1200 Lone Pine Road, the Hills of Lone Pine, and various addresses, Tom. Yes. So today, we're gonna be looking at an extension of the fence proposal, which has previously come before the DRB and the ZBA for the Hills of Lone Pine. I think it was earlier in January. The Hills came to the DRB to install some signage in the common areas that they have along their perimeter, and some neighboring property owners liked the fence and requested that the fence be installed on their property. So this was the plan submitted in December. where it is. Let's go,lei, and let's go see what's going on. When we remember the middle and嘉ley a terminal time vy Thank you. is what we're considering today and it's going to be a six foot high rail fence similar to what was installed previously and it'll need to go to the zoning board of appeals for exceeding exceeding the four foot height limits and they have made application for that and they'll proceed if approved today so they're cleaning up some of their fences that are there they're going to get rid of some of the chicken wire fences they have they're going to get rid of the chicken wire and this all started by with an assessment that they asked the bloomfield township police departments to do for security and this is a measure installing fences again i understand the need for that and it's also it's attractive they've done a nice job with it if i may patrick funke from dual landscape architecture the fence will be identical to what was approved in january by both your board as well as the zoning board of appeals uh so be the same contractor same manufacturer six foot high wrought iron looking it's aluminum so it won't rust but we're going to get rid of the bamboo fences the wood fences the farm fences what we received approval for in january were the common areas once the neighbors had heard that oh the common areas got approved can we do our yards we're interested so we have a petition from that we submitted to tom uh with their signatures to be considered to be heard in front of you and the uh board of appeal. So thank you for your consideration. Okay. Um, then do we need four motions or can we do this all as one? I think you can do them all as one. All right. Then I'll make a motion that we approve the, uh, site improvement proposal as submitted. Support. All in favor. Oh, and forward it to the

11. 12:30

    this all started by with an assessment that they asked the bloomfield township police departments to do for security and this is a measure installing fences again i understand the need for that and it's also it's attractive they've done a nice job with it if i may patrick funke from dual landscape architecture the fence will be identical to what was approved in january by both your board as well as the zoning board of appeals uh so be the same contractor same manufacturer six foot high wrought iron looking it's aluminum so it won't rust but we're going to get rid of the bamboo fences the wood fences the farm fences what we received approval for in january were the common areas once the neighbors had heard that oh the common areas got approved can we do our yards we're interested so we have a petition from that we submitted to tom uh with their signatures to be considered to be heard in front of you and the uh board of appeal. So thank you for your consideration. Okay. Um, then do we need four motions or can we do this all as one? I think you can do them all as one. All right. Then I'll make a motion that we approve the, uh, site improvement proposal as submitted. Support. All in favor. Oh, and forward it to the ZBA for their consideration. And that's support. All in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Pass three nothing. Thank you, Patrick. Good luck. Good to see you. Okay. Site plan for 350 West Big Beaver Road, the hamlet of Bloomfield Manor. Don? Corey's going to be presenting this one. Corey? All right. So our final case tonight is a site plan for a single-family residential development off of Manor Road. This gives you an idea of where it sits within our zoning map. It is this portion right here composed of three separate parcels. As part of this application, they will be combining and then reconfiguring the parcels on site. This white space, this is all Birmingham. This is the golf course to the north. This is the city of Birmingham. There's a multi, or several single-family homes right over here. And then within the township, the only adjacent properties are these single-family homes here. You can see where there was a house on the property here, and I believe in an associated accessory structure. Those have since been removed, so currently these three parcels are vacant.

12. 13:45

    the, uh, site improvement proposal as submitted. Support. All in favor. Oh, and forward it to the ZBA for their consideration. And that's support. All in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Pass three nothing. Thank you, Patrick. Good luck. Good to see you. Okay. Site plan for 350 West Big Beaver Road, the hamlet of Bloomfield Manor. Don? Corey's going to be presenting this one. Corey? All right. So our final case tonight is a site plan for a single-family residential development off of Manor Road. This gives you an idea of where it sits within our zoning map. It is this portion right here composed of three separate parcels. As part of this application, they will be combining and then reconfiguring the parcels on site. This white space, this is all Birmingham. This is the golf course to the north. This is the city of Birmingham. There's a multi, or several single-family homes right over here. And then within the township, the only adjacent properties are these single-family homes here. You can see where there was a house on the property here, and I believe in an associated accessory structure. Those have since been removed, so currently these three parcels are vacant. Here's an aerial of the same site confirming the house was removed you can see this space over here It's labeled differently depending on the source. I'm looking at but what I'm getting is that it's the Birmingham Manor Preserve Park so yeah, there is a functioning park over here And as part of this application the applicant is actually intending to maintain and preserve a trail that I believe goes through here So that they won't be interrupting any access to that park Other notable features is the train over here. We have Big Beaver Road to the north They are not proposing any access direct access to Big Beaver Road. It's gonna be all-off manner And so running through the site plans as proposed they're Submitting this under the open space preservation option within our ordinance There's different types of residential developments that developers can apply through You're probably most recently familiar with the cluster housing option through the enclave development This is the open space option that they're proposing and as part of that they're required to maintain at least 50% of the site as open space Accessible to all the residents so you can see with the hashing here They are proposing their common space to completely surround the proposed lots. They are proposing six lots

13. 15:00

    Here's an aerial of the same site confirming the house was removed you can see this space over here It's labeled differently depending on the source. I'm looking at but what I'm getting is that it's the Birmingham Manor Preserve Park so yeah, there is a functioning park over here And as part of this application the applicant is actually intending to maintain and preserve a trail that I believe goes through here So that they won't be interrupting any access to that park Other notable features is the train over here. We have Big Beaver Road to the north They are not proposing any access direct access to Big Beaver Road. It's gonna be all-off manner And so running through the site plans as proposed they're Submitting this under the open space preservation option within our ordinance There's different types of residential developments that developers can apply through You're probably most recently familiar with the cluster housing option through the enclave development This is the open space option that they're proposing and as part of that they're required to maintain at least 50% of the site as open space Accessible to all the residents so you can see with the hashing here They are proposing their common space to completely surround the proposed lots. They are proposing six lots So each lot will have direct access to the commons as well as roadway access over here Most lots are between 18,000 and 20,000 square feet. I think there's one and there's two that exceed 20,000 slightly, but generally they're slightly under what is permitted in the R3 district, which is the underlying zoning. However, as part of the open space option, they are permitted to, there's some flexibility there, they're permitted to deviate in order to preserve that open space, so it's a bit of a trade-off. But they are still proposing fairly large lots. The ordinance requirement I think is 20,000 or 22. They're coming in at 18 to 20 is roughly the range. Six lots, 3.67 acres of the site will be open space, so that's slightly more than half. So they're meeting their ordinance there. In terms of landscaping and design, the primary concern from staff's perspective, of course, is adequately buffering the development from existing residential development, the neighbors over to the west. And so the applicant is proposing a double row in some parts and a single and other of full evergreen plantings

14. 16:15

    They are proposing their common space to completely surround the proposed lots. They are proposing six lots So each lot will have direct access to the commons as well as roadway access over here Most lots are between 18,000 and 20,000 square feet. I think there's one and there's two that exceed 20,000 slightly, but generally they're slightly under what is permitted in the R3 district, which is the underlying zoning. However, as part of the open space option, they are permitted to, there's some flexibility there, they're permitted to deviate in order to preserve that open space, so it's a bit of a trade-off. But they are still proposing fairly large lots. The ordinance requirement I think is 20,000 or 22. They're coming in at 18 to 20 is roughly the range. Six lots, 3.67 acres of the site will be open space, so that's slightly more than half. So they're meeting their ordinance there. In terms of landscaping and design, the primary concern from staff's perspective, of course, is adequately buffering the development from existing residential development, the neighbors over to the west. And so the applicant is proposing a double row in some parts and a single and other of full evergreen plantings that is gonna run the entire western perimeter of the property. So there's gonna be an evergreen canopy, shrub, understory, and then more decorative features towards the entrance of the site. For the east property line, this is fronting on parkland, so it's a little less imperative that this be buffered. There's going to be existing vegetation providing a buffer over here. In terms of design elements, I'm gonna draw your attention to the entranceway. When I spoke with you ... earlier, Mr. Shostak, I mentioned there was a gate. There is not a gate. They are proposing just this sign right here, this entry detail, and then this fence slash wall that is going to be under four feet. So meeting our ordinance requirement in terms of fences. Those elements are proposed on either side of the entranceway here. So again, no gate, but several decorative elements in order to invite people in. A little less intense than we were kind of picturing. I mean, this kind of signage is much more appropriate. In terms of how parcels will actually be at the end, my understanding, and the applicant can correct me if I'm wrong, is that each lot will be its own parcel for taxation purposes, and the common space will be a separate parcel

15. 17:30

    and a single and other of full evergreen plantings that is gonna run the entire western perimeter of the property. So there's gonna be an evergreen canopy, shrub, understory, and then more decorative features towards the entrance of the site. For the east property line, this is fronting on parkland, so it's a little less imperative that this be buffered. There's going to be existing vegetation providing a buffer over here. In terms of design elements, I'm gonna draw your attention to the entranceway. When I spoke with you ... earlier, Mr. Shostak, I mentioned there was a gate. There is not a gate. They are proposing just this sign right here, this entry detail, and then this fence slash wall that is going to be under four feet. So meeting our ordinance requirement in terms of fences. Those elements are proposed on either side of the entranceway here. So again, no gate, but several decorative elements in order to invite people in. A little less intense than we were kind of picturing. I mean, this kind of signage is much more appropriate. In terms of how parcels will actually be at the end, my understanding, and the applicant can correct me if I'm wrong, is that each lot will be its own parcel for taxation purposes, and the common space will be a separate parcel on its own. So that should answer that question. And then in terms of reviews from other departments, the fire department has reviewed the plans. They've indicated that there are several elements that will have to be included once we get later on in the process. So they mentioned they need, the fire department indicates the development must demonstrate compliance with fire code requirements, including hydrant spacing, fire flow, address identification, and construction phase access and water supply. Additional provisions such as NOx access and defensible space may be required prior to construction. These are concerns that will be ironed out throughout this process. In terms of police department review, the police department has no crime prevention concerns. Our landscape architect reviewed the site and finds that the plan generally is acceptable. They note that additional items may be needed in the future, but in that, they're talking about the detention basin, the engineering review noted that there might be some required fencing around that. So they just, the landscape architect wants to note that if so, that fencing will have to be screened. A traffic impact reviewer looked at the project

16. 18:45

    lot will be its own parcel for taxation purposes, and the common space will be a separate parcel on its own. So that should answer that question. And then in terms of reviews from other departments, the fire department has reviewed the plans. They've indicated that there are several elements that will have to be included once we get later on in the process. So they mentioned they need, the fire department indicates the development must demonstrate compliance with fire code requirements, including hydrant spacing, fire flow, address identification, and construction phase access and water supply. Additional provisions such as NOx access and defensible space may be required prior to construction. These are concerns that will be ironed out throughout this process. In terms of police department review, the police department has no crime prevention concerns. Our landscape architect reviewed the site and finds that the plan generally is acceptable. They note that additional items may be needed in the future, but in that, they're talking about the detention basin, the engineering review noted that there might be some required fencing around that. So they just, the landscape architect wants to note that if so, that fencing will have to be screened. A traffic impact reviewer looked at the project and they determined that only 75 extra trips per day will be generated. So it'll be very minimal impact off of Manor Road. When it comes to EESD, there is outstanding, one major outstanding concern. So they do not recommend approval at this time. That would be final approval. Their concern is in regard to the wetland on site, which is located right here. And the issue at hand isn't encroachment because as proposed, the buildable area is well outside the 25 foot setback. So the concern with the wetland has nothing to do with encroachment or development in it. The concern is that as the plan currently stands, they're proposing stormwater discharge into it. If that's the case, further analysis needs to be done to see whether or not this is a protected, regulated wetland by EGLE. When our team went out to do that analysis, they went in November, I believe, and they couldn't conduct the analysis because we're not in the growing season. So they just note that at this time, they can't confirm it is compliant. I agree with you. And he just agreed with the Probe there's not going to be an industry But if you look at the current day, what's going to be an industry? What's going to be a big, big, big, big one? I'm going to be an industry. It's going to be an industry. Thank you. to do a follow-up inspection during the growing season so later in may maybe june that is an issue that has to be ironed out before we ever bring this to the township board before the design board's purposes this will have no impact on the design of the site so i believe that's it

17. 20:00

    A traffic impact reviewer looked at the project and they determined that only 75 extra trips per day will be generated. So it'll be very minimal impact off of Manor Road. When it comes to EESD, there is outstanding, one major outstanding concern. So they do not recommend approval at this time. That would be final approval. Their concern is in regard to the wetland on site, which is located right here. And the issue at hand isn't encroachment because as proposed, the buildable area is well outside the 25 foot setback. So the concern with the wetland has nothing to do with encroachment or development in it. The concern is that as the plan currently stands, they're proposing stormwater discharge into it. If that's the case, further analysis needs to be done to see whether or not this is a protected, regulated wetland by EGLE. When our team went out to do that analysis, they went in November, I believe, and they couldn't conduct the analysis because we're not in the growing season. So they just note that at this time, they can't confirm it is compliant. I agree with you. And he just agreed with the Probe there's not going to be an industry But if you look at the current day, what's going to be an industry? What's going to be a big, big, big, big one? I'm going to be an industry. It's going to be an industry. Thank you. to do a follow-up inspection during the growing season so later in may maybe june that is an issue that has to be ironed out before we ever bring this to the township board before the design board's purposes this will have no impact on the design of the site so i believe that's it for my presentation uh there is going to be variances needed or not necessarily variances but the design the elements at the entrance way the sign the fencing that will all have to get approval from the zba as well so the next board for them will be zba followed by planning commission and then township board are there any questions for me doesn't the planning commission come first planning commission then zba yeah yeah yeah um are there any proposals for decks or patios um so we do have they can elaborate further on that but i did want to share uh they don't have designs done of what the uh homes will look like but they have conceptual images and they can elaborate further on what how the site the individual dots will be developed do you want to come up and introduce yourself and give us a little update let me know what you want me to throw up oh okay we'll start hi i'm howard i'm the most of howard finger work uh with uh as the applicant i'm with uh with me nikki jeffries so the easy questions i will field more difficult ones we'll let uh nikki take over uh these are just strictly uh inspirational photos okay so

18. 21:15

    design board's purposes this will have no impact on the design of the site so i believe that's it for my presentation uh there is going to be variances needed or not necessarily variances but the design the elements at the entrance way the sign the fencing that will all have to get approval from the zba as well so the next board for them will be zba followed by planning commission and then township board are there any questions for me doesn't the planning commission come first planning commission then zba yeah yeah yeah um are there any proposals for decks or patios um so we do have they can elaborate further on that but i did want to share uh they don't have designs done of what the uh homes will look like but they have conceptual images and they can elaborate further on what how the site the individual dots will be developed do you want to come up and introduce yourself and give us a little update let me know what you want me to throw up oh okay we'll start hi i'm howard i'm the most of howard finger work uh with uh as the applicant i'm with uh with me nikki jeffries so the easy questions i will field more difficult ones we'll let uh nikki take over uh these are just strictly uh inspirational photos okay so We're the developer of this site. I don't anticipate building the homes in here. So we'll develop the site and sell it to a builder or multiple custom builders. Howard, do you know with the landscaping, the height of the perimeter plantings? Nikki, have we defined that? Yeah, we do have a landscape plan. Let me look. And I also want to point our alcohol. I told you she has the hard questions. This site is pretty treed also, as you guys can see. So to start, we would just be clearing to get the utilities and the road in. Down the line, there will probably be some additional trees that will have to come down to build the homes. But we're going to try to maintain as much around the edge to buffer from the neighbors as possible. And then, obviously, we're going to be adding a bunch of trees along the western property line. I'm just pulling up the landscape plan. So those along the west property line, those are Norway's spruce, 14 foot in height. Yeah.

19. 22:30

    We're the developer of this site. I don't anticipate building the homes in here. So we'll develop the site and sell it to a builder or multiple custom builders. Howard, do you know with the landscaping, the height of the perimeter plantings? Nikki, have we defined that? Yeah, we do have a landscape plan. Let me look. And I also want to point our alcohol. I told you she has the hard questions. This site is pretty treed also, as you guys can see. So to start, we would just be clearing to get the utilities and the road in. Down the line, there will probably be some additional trees that will have to come down to build the homes. But we're going to try to maintain as much around the edge to buffer from the neighbors as possible. And then, obviously, we're going to be adding a bunch of trees along the western property line. I'm just pulling up the landscape plan. So those along the west property line, those are Norway's spruce, 14 foot in height. Yeah. So those are pretty substantial. I typically, in like a number of other subs, we do like eight foot high. Yeah. Coming back to my question about decks and patios. You know, that's going to be part of the... I think we've done that. I don't know. Yeah. Well, I think we're gonna fix that one piece of paper. And we know that uh... I think the immunity levels are going to be theancia in that country. Uh... Thank you. permitting process when someone goes when one of the builder goes in to build houses is how do we normally handle that quarry so typically decks and terraces when attached to the house that would just be a building permit that wouldn't have to get any accessory structure approval some elements that could go on the decks like uh some elements like fireplaces or seating those may have to go um and then any accessory sheds or anything if there aren't any restrictions the people who live there are allowed to you know put up accessory structures that would all have to go to the cba so we had an issue with the legacy and why was it an issue there but it's not here my quarter wasn't here yet so i don't know but it was it was a other another development that we had no howard you started legacy hills uh yeah i developed that site right so we we've consistently had problems with decks and patios between the development and the neighbors saying that there wasn't wasn't in the original planning it wasn't things like that so i guess what i'm understanding

20. 23:45

    So those are pretty substantial. I typically, in like a number of other subs, we do like eight foot high. Yeah. Coming back to my question about decks and patios. You know, that's going to be part of the... I think we've done that. I don't know. Yeah. Well, I think we're gonna fix that one piece of paper. And we know that uh... I think the immunity levels are going to be theancia in that country. Uh... Thank you. permitting process when someone goes when one of the builder goes in to build houses is how do we normally handle that quarry so typically decks and terraces when attached to the house that would just be a building permit that wouldn't have to get any accessory structure approval some elements that could go on the decks like uh some elements like fireplaces or seating those may have to go um and then any accessory sheds or anything if there aren't any restrictions the people who live there are allowed to you know put up accessory structures that would all have to go to the cba so we had an issue with the legacy and why was it an issue there but it's not here my quarter wasn't here yet so i don't know but it was it was a other another development that we had no howard you started legacy hills uh yeah i developed that site right so we we've consistently had problems with decks and patios between the development and the neighbors saying that there wasn't wasn't in the original planning it wasn't things like that so i guess what i'm understanding from what you're saying is that we're being asked to approve the site plan with an unknown or uncertain issue regarding decks and patios because the decks and patios are typically beyond these items or is the fact that it or is the fact that it's um an open space although it's like it's the open space also okay so well i um i can't off the top of my head tell you what your ordinance regarding desks and patios but the box that we show there is the building envelope so it's a setback so anything built within the building envelope as long as it conforms to your ordinance for example some ordinance that require anything over three foot have a rail items like that but in terms of dimensionally you can build within the building envelope and then there's certain things you can do outside the building envelope in the setback for example paver patios or concrete patios typically can be outside okay but again that's all defined in the subdivision regulations or your ordinance and I could just elaborate a little bit so decks and patios have to meet the setbacks of the primary structure so in their case they are deviating from what the ordinance requirement is

21. 25:00

    wasn't wasn't in the original planning it wasn't things like that so i guess what i'm understanding from what you're saying is that we're being asked to approve the site plan with an unknown or uncertain issue regarding decks and patios because the decks and patios are typically beyond these items or is the fact that it or is the fact that it's um an open space although it's like it's the open space also okay so well i um i can't off the top of my head tell you what your ordinance regarding desks and patios but the box that we show there is the building envelope so it's a setback so anything built within the building envelope as long as it conforms to your ordinance for example some ordinance that require anything over three foot have a rail items like that but in terms of dimensionally you can build within the building envelope and then there's certain things you can do outside the building envelope in the setback for example paver patios or concrete patios typically can be outside okay but again that's all defined in the subdivision regulations or your ordinance and I could just elaborate a little bit so decks and patios have to meet the setbacks of the primary structure so in their case they are deviating from what the ordinance requirement is but they're making new guarantees so the billable area sorry so this front yard setbacks will be 30 feet the rear will be 25 and the side will be 16 so no patios or decks could be built encroaching those setbacks meaning beyond those correct or into those setbacks right okay the one difference like legacy hills didn't have separate lots whereas this does legacy hills was a condo so there was not the same setback or the building envelope pretty close together yeah so so there are also natural feature setbacks that I know were encroached by the that was part of the issue yeah the decks were encroaching into the natural feature correct okay yeah and how we're How big, when you're going to sell these to a builder, how big do you see the homes, 5,000 square feet? Four to 5,000 is what I would envision. You could build a bigger house given this footprint. But that's kind of what I would envision. Is the road going to be paved? Yes. Okay, so the road will be paved even though Manor is not. Correct. And the road's going to be paved according to the specifications of the road commission. We're proposing a private road, but I think your zoning ordinance says it has to meet RCOC standards,

22. 26:15

    the primary structure so in their case they are deviating from what the ordinance requirement is but they're making new guarantees so the billable area sorry so this front yard setbacks will be 30 feet the rear will be 25 and the side will be 16 so no patios or decks could be built encroaching those setbacks meaning beyond those correct or into those setbacks right okay the one difference like legacy hills didn't have separate lots whereas this does legacy hills was a condo so there was not the same setback or the building envelope pretty close together yeah so so there are also natural feature setbacks that I know were encroached by the that was part of the issue yeah the decks were encroaching into the natural feature correct okay yeah and how we're How big, when you're going to sell these to a builder, how big do you see the homes, 5,000 square feet? Four to 5,000 is what I would envision. You could build a bigger house given this footprint. But that's kind of what I would envision. Is the road going to be paved? Yes. Okay, so the road will be paved even though Manor is not. Correct. And the road's going to be paved according to the specifications of the road commission. We're proposing a private road, but I think your zoning ordinance says it has to meet RCOC standards, so it will, and which is how it's drawn right now. Okay. With a 60-foot right away. Yep. Okay. It looks really good. Thank you. Obviously, you've done your homework and you know the history very well. I think it looks great and certainly, I can't speak for the neighbors, but it's certainly a lot more attractive with fewer homes than the original plans. So, anyway, I want to make them. Have the neighbors been involved? Yeah, you know, the neighbors, when we first submitted, got noticed. And I met with a handful of them at one point. And then three or four other ones, including the HOA president, have called me, and I had long conversations with each one of those, including the neighbor to our southwest. And he was very happy the way we reconfigured it. was no houses in his i'm sorry to the northwest okay in his backyard so yes we a handful i don't know if it was six or eight but well it's not a big it's not a big sub right and i've spoken to some of the neighbors i can't speak for all of them but i've spoken to some of them and they they've been supportive when i've spoken to um unless you have other no so we just we accept it

23. 27:30

    but I think your zoning ordinance says it has to meet RCOC standards, so it will, and which is how it's drawn right now. Okay. With a 60-foot right away. Yep. Okay. It looks really good. Thank you. Obviously, you've done your homework and you know the history very well. I think it looks great and certainly, I can't speak for the neighbors, but it's certainly a lot more attractive with fewer homes than the original plans. So, anyway, I want to make them. Have the neighbors been involved? Yeah, you know, the neighbors, when we first submitted, got noticed. And I met with a handful of them at one point. And then three or four other ones, including the HOA president, have called me, and I had long conversations with each one of those, including the neighbor to our southwest. And he was very happy the way we reconfigured it. was no houses in his i'm sorry to the northwest okay in his backyard so yes we a handful i don't know if it was six or eight but well it's not a big it's not a big sub right and i've spoken to some of the neighbors i can't speak for all of them but i've spoken to some of them and they they've been supportive when i've spoken to um unless you have other no so we just we accept it yeah make a motion that um we accept as presented at this time and planning commission yeah well yeah it'll go through the process yes it will go through the process of the different uh boards and commissions yep uh support all in favor say aye aye any opposed pass three nothing thank you oh thank you good to see you okay general business our next meeting is scheduled for wednesday april the 15th we'll move to adjourn so moved so moved all right we are adjourned thank you thank you guys thank you very thank you