the-compact
Design Review Board Thursday, November 6, 2025 · 59 min

Bloomfield Township Design Review Board Meeting on November 5, 2025

Summary

The city council meeting discussed various proposals for sign installations, facade upgrades, and liquor license requests for businesses in the area, with some approvals and amendments made.

  • City council approves application to install a new sign for a bank on Telegraph Road.
  • The board discusses and approves a sign for Crumble Cookies on Telegraph Road, addressing compatibility and size issues.
  • City council discusses proposal for Crumble Cookies sign rebranding, citing inconsistency with design and coloring standards.
  • Western Market proposes a rebranding as Nourish by Western Market, with exterior alterations and increased accessibility.
  • City council discusses regulations and plans for a new market in the community.

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Topics

Transcript

Click any timestamp to jump the video to that moment. Auto-transcribed; expect occasional errors on proper nouns.

  1. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

  2. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

  3. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

  4. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. So it needs a variance for the two signs and for the illustration, right? They're allowed one sign and then they'll need a variance for the secondary sign and then the illustration on the wall sign. Otherwise, it meets the... Yes. size requirements. Okay, you may not know the answer to this question, but there's, you know, a series of other businesses all along Telegraph there that, you know, front up close. And are they all in the same?

  5. Thank you. So it needs a variance for the two signs and for the illustration, right? They're allowed one sign and then they'll need a variance for the secondary sign and then the illustration on the wall sign. Otherwise, it meets the... Yes. size requirements. Okay, you may not know the answer to this question, but there's, you know, a series of other businesses all along Telegraph there that, you know, front up close. And are they all in the same? Do they all have monument signs up front? Well, the monument proposed for this location, if you want to pull up the site plan, is actually slightly different. It's actually not right along the Telegraph road frontage. It's actually interior to the access road that leads you into the credit union. Oh, there it is. So it's not quite as visible. I think the intention and the sign contractor, I'm sure, can speak a little more clearly to that. So you're not going to see it as visible along Telegraph road. It's really to give a location closer to that interior road that takes you into the site. Because there's really only one access point in the upper right-hand photograph. The access into the site is actually not directly off Telegraph road. Thank you. Yeah. Good afternoon. My name is Paul Dieters. I'm with Metro Signs and Lighting. And with me here today also is Edward Seeland, who's the vice president of facilities for DFCU. So thank you for your consideration. As Andrea had mentioned, there are a little bit of a challenge. This sign is really just going to help people because without an entrance off of Telegraph, as people come in, it would be difficult to discern how to get into the bank. There is not, nor are we proposing a wall sign facing north, which would be at the entry drive.

  6. And are they all in the same? Do they all have monument signs up front? Well, the monument proposed for this location, if you want to pull up the site plan, is actually slightly different. It's actually not right along the Telegraph road frontage. It's actually interior to the access road that leads you into the credit union. Oh, there it is. So it's not quite as visible. I think the intention and the sign contractor, I'm sure, can speak a little more clearly to that. So you're not going to see it as visible along Telegraph road. It's really to give a location closer to that interior road that takes you into the site. Because there's really only one access point in the upper right-hand photograph. The access into the site is actually not directly off Telegraph road. Thank you. Yeah. Good afternoon. My name is Paul Dieters. I'm with Metro Signs and Lighting. And with me here today also is Edward Seeland, who's the vice president of facilities for DFCU. So thank you for your consideration. As Andrea had mentioned, there are a little bit of a challenge. This sign is really just going to help people because without an entrance off of Telegraph, as people come in, it would be difficult to discern how to get into the bank. There is not, nor are we proposing a wall sign facing north, which would be at the entry drive. So people would pull in and then not be able to see any identification for the bank. And we're hoping this is just gonna enable people to figure out which way to navigate through there. menu So from Telegraph, you're gonna see the wall sign? because there's two Miller From Telegraph, that is correct. in the second half ahead with news. And so, and we're proposing, we have an application, Uh-oh. And the rest of the day will have to go. So you are currently on the Everytime Day, as I said, for the ZBA, for the column, maybe I'm still at the end of my cell phone. So Iле gave you one of my favorite т rêve, element, a logo, that you could see. They, like others there, Huntington Bank, Chase, the other, prior to that, and a number of other places, that logo is a very prominent feature of their branding. They've got almost 35 or 37 facilities now, and that's a big piece of that. And with them being set so far back off the road and not having a ground sign, and I think this will help identify the facility. I think it's to scale, given the size of the building, too. Okay. I'm good with it.

  7. So people would pull in and then not be able to see any identification for the bank. And we're hoping this is just gonna enable people to figure out which way to navigate through there. menu So from Telegraph, you're gonna see the wall sign? because there's two Miller From Telegraph, that is correct. in the second half ahead with news. And so, and we're proposing, we have an application, Uh-oh. And the rest of the day will have to go. So you are currently on the Everytime Day, as I said, for the ZBA, for the column, maybe I'm still at the end of my cell phone. So Iле gave you one of my favorite т rêve, element, a logo, that you could see. They, like others there, Huntington Bank, Chase, the other, prior to that, and a number of other places, that logo is a very prominent feature of their branding. They've got almost 35 or 37 facilities now, and that's a big piece of that. And with them being set so far back off the road and not having a ground sign, and I think this will help identify the facility. I think it's to scale, given the size of the building, too. Okay. I'm good with it. Okay. Then I'll make a motion that we approve the submission and forward it to the ZBA for their consideration. Support. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Passes three to nothing. Thank you very much. Thank you. item number three four zero three six Telegraph Road crumble cookies crumble cookies is located on Telegraph Road 4036 there's an area of the property the sign complies with the requirements of the townships ordinances it will be 22.5 square feet total there'll be no illustrations and it projects four inches from the facade I'll note on the bottom right you might not see it clearly on the screen but it says existing interior hanging sign to be removed staff recommends that the board include that in the motion for consideration but isn't there already a sign there there is a sign they are going to replace us with this

  8. Okay. Then I'll make a motion that we approve the submission and forward it to the ZBA for their consideration. Support. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Passes three to nothing. Thank you very much. Thank you. item number three four zero three six Telegraph Road crumble cookies crumble cookies is located on Telegraph Road 4036 there's an area of the property the sign complies with the requirements of the townships ordinances it will be 22.5 square feet total there'll be no illustrations and it projects four inches from the facade I'll note on the bottom right you might not see it clearly on the screen but it says existing interior hanging sign to be removed staff recommends that the board include that in the motion for consideration but isn't there already a sign there there is a sign they are going to replace us with this the difference is you can see the pink background so that's the existing side yeah where's it right there oh yeah okay I see I see they're just adding the pink change of colors with the pink background and then the sign is going to be black color right is there going to be a lighting change so at the bottom here you can see you at night it will be illuminated white you And we do have some photographs of the rest of the remaining of the shopping center as we can point out that when we're looking at the overall consistency of other signage within the shopping center, this isn't exactly, it's different. It's not a channel letter like what they currently have. So we just wanted to bring that to your attention that it is not, the pink signage is different if you want to look at the other signs that are out there. So the board may want to take that into consideration in terms of the compatibility. And while I'm not a crumble cookie expert, it looks a little bit like a logo. With the pink and the words, could it be considered a logo and there's a size variance issue there? Well, we've never, well.

  9. there already a sign there there is a sign they are going to replace us with this the difference is you can see the pink background so that's the existing side yeah where's it right there oh yeah okay I see I see they're just adding the pink change of colors with the pink background and then the sign is going to be black color right is there going to be a lighting change so at the bottom here you can see you at night it will be illuminated white you And we do have some photographs of the rest of the remaining of the shopping center as we can point out that when we're looking at the overall consistency of other signage within the shopping center, this isn't exactly, it's different. It's not a channel letter like what they currently have. So we just wanted to bring that to your attention that it is not, the pink signage is different if you want to look at the other signs that are out there. So the board may want to take that into consideration in terms of the compatibility. And while I'm not a crumble cookie expert, it looks a little bit like a logo. With the pink and the words, could it be considered a logo and there's a size variance issue there? Well, we've never, well. And the way it's. We've never treated the color of a sign, specifically a backing to be a variance. However, I can understand if we're looking at just the color being a logo. It's usually, we've usually looked at it in the past more in terms of compatibility with the design and the coloring across the other. It doesn't look compatible to me. Correct. I agree with that point. Plus the idea, just the way, I mean, look at the box, it's pink. It looks like the box with the logo on it. Like if you get a box of them, that's what I think it looks like. And the logo, I mean, just like on the other issue with the bank, I mean, the logo. are regulated the size and how it's used and so I I'm not actually a fan of this proposal for inconsistency purposes and in my view it's the overall the way it's been changed is makes it now look the whole thing as a logo and is there anybody here from crumble cookies mind coming up to the podium we

  10. Well, we've never, well. And the way it's. We've never treated the color of a sign, specifically a backing to be a variance. However, I can understand if we're looking at just the color being a logo. It's usually, we've usually looked at it in the past more in terms of compatibility with the design and the coloring across the other. It doesn't look compatible to me. Correct. I agree with that point. Plus the idea, just the way, I mean, look at the box, it's pink. It looks like the box with the logo on it. Like if you get a box of them, that's what I think it looks like. And the logo, I mean, just like on the other issue with the bank, I mean, the logo. are regulated the size and how it's used and so I I'm not actually a fan of this proposal for inconsistency purposes and in my view it's the overall the way it's been changed is makes it now look the whole thing as a logo and is there anybody here from crumble cookies mind coming up to the podium we can ask a question good afternoon good afternoon my name is Tammy long I work for another sign who's been contracted to do crumble cookies okay they're just doing a rebrand is what they're asking and all the crumble cookies are going to as does have the back pink backer like that in other cities it's just such a change from what is kind of a need to say a standard but if you go to that mall strip mall you know there's like the bagel company there's Starbucks there's the nail salon if you look at the signs there's the wrong channel letter yeah yeah Yeah. I don't know what would change my mind about, you know, my opinion on that, but in the past we've had the owner come, too, and I don't know whether she could say anything that would change my mind, but I guess we could consider either, you know, tabling it

  11. is there anybody here from crumble cookies mind coming up to the podium we can ask a question good afternoon good afternoon my name is Tammy long I work for another sign who's been contracted to do crumble cookies okay they're just doing a rebrand is what they're asking and all the crumble cookies are going to as does have the back pink backer like that in other cities it's just such a change from what is kind of a need to say a standard but if you go to that mall strip mall you know there's like the bagel company there's Starbucks there's the nail salon if you look at the signs there's the wrong channel letter yeah yeah Yeah. I don't know what would change my mind about, you know, my opinion on that, but in the past we've had the owner come, too, and I don't know whether she could say anything that would change my mind, but I guess we could consider either, you know, tabling it to see if she wants to come speak on the issue or just take a vote. Our next meeting will be in, what, two weeks? Correct. Okay. Why don't you have the owner stop in and address it with us, okay? I think we've got some questions on the coloring of the sign and the change not really fitting in with what's there. Maybe we can come to a consensus if she's here to help us work through it. Okay. Thank you. I'll let the person let them know that you have the owner come in. That'd be great. In two weeks? Yeah. So I'll make a motion that we table this until the next meeting. Support. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. All right. Item number four, 6255 Telegraph Road, Primrose Schools. Welcome back. Oh, hey, Corey. I actually think I'm going to take this one. Corey is prepared to as well. I provided you each a copy at your place setting in terms of what has occurred between the original design review board review for the ground sign for Primrose that occurred on 5-21-25. And then I want to get this one. It's done. I want to encourage you to take this one.

  12. that would change my mind, but I guess we could consider either, you know, tabling it to see if she wants to come speak on the issue or just take a vote. Our next meeting will be in, what, two weeks? Correct. Okay. Why don't you have the owner stop in and address it with us, okay? I think we've got some questions on the coloring of the sign and the change not really fitting in with what's there. Maybe we can come to a consensus if she's here to help us work through it. Okay. Thank you. I'll let the person let them know that you have the owner come in. That'd be great. In two weeks? Yeah. So I'll make a motion that we table this until the next meeting. Support. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. All right. Item number four, 6255 Telegraph Road, Primrose Schools. Welcome back. Oh, hey, Corey. I actually think I'm going to take this one. Corey is prepared to as well. I provided you each a copy at your place setting in terms of what has occurred between the original design review board review for the ground sign for Primrose that occurred on 5-21-25. And then I want to get this one. It's done. I want to encourage you to take this one. In doing an ample amount of research on this, 비'se. I think that there was probably, I have the history written down, I also drew a table and a hand-drawn rendering, please apologize, my drawing of comparing what went to the DRB versus what is now existing on site. So I do want to note that what the design review board approved on 5-21-25 was actually an overall sign. Overall, sign size of 43.8 square feet. And actually the sign that we're looking at that is in the field currently that the applicant is asking for approval on is actually slightly smaller at a 39.7 square foot. However, it got brought to our attention at that design review board meeting that there was some miscommunication that occurred on behalf of our department as well as the applicant. So in doing my research, I did have a conversation with our building division in regards to the application that was applied for. It was approved by the building department in 7-21-25. And it did have the attached design review board sign attached to that sign review,

  13. In doing an ample amount of research on this, 비'se. I think that there was probably, I have the history written down, I also drew a table and a hand-drawn rendering, please apologize, my drawing of comparing what went to the DRB versus what is now existing on site. So I do want to note that what the design review board approved on 5-21-25 was actually an overall sign. Overall, sign size of 43.8 square feet. And actually the sign that we're looking at that is in the field currently that the applicant is asking for approval on is actually slightly smaller at a 39.7 square foot. However, it got brought to our attention at that design review board meeting that there was some miscommunication that occurred on behalf of our department as well as the applicant. So in doing my research, I did have a conversation with our building division in regards to the application that was applied for. It was approved by the building department in 7-21-25. And it did have the attached design review board sign attached to that sign review, which we do usually include for building permits. And there was a approval at that time of that sign that was submitted for the building permit. After that building permit was approved by our building official, and it was brought a little, it was brought on to our educational to the attention of the planning that the sign that was installed did not comply with the design review board approval. Sign revisions were in fact then resubmitted to the building division at the end of July, so July 31st, 25. The revisions submitted by the applicant did not match what was constructed in the field. The planning denied sending the sign back to the DRB due to the change in the field. And then the sign that was presented at the 10-1 DRB meeting was tabled due to more information being requested. So a couple things that we learned from this experience is that moving forward we will have a member of our planning team will be reviewing all building permits related to signs. And I will say on behalf of the individual who did approve the sign, it was a very moderate size change. And they actually have an extremely good track record of being very fine-tuned when it comes to our signage, so it was kind of an unfortunate situation. And then in terms of a conversation regarding the conversation between the revisions that were

  14. attached to that sign review, which we do usually include for building permits. And there was a approval at that time of that sign that was submitted for the building permit. After that building permit was approved by our building official, and it was brought a little, it was brought on to our educational to the attention of the planning that the sign that was installed did not comply with the design review board approval. Sign revisions were in fact then resubmitted to the building division at the end of July, so July 31st, 25. The revisions submitted by the applicant did not match what was constructed in the field. The planning denied sending the sign back to the DRB due to the change in the field. And then the sign that was presented at the 10-1 DRB meeting was tabled due to more information being requested. So a couple things that we learned from this experience is that moving forward we will have a member of our planning team will be reviewing all building permits related to signs. And I will say on behalf of the individual who did approve the sign, it was a very moderate size change. And they actually have an extremely good track record of being very fine-tuned when it comes to our signage, so it was kind of an unfortunate situation. And then in terms of a conversation regarding the conversation between the revisions that were submitted to our department and approved, those permits had been approved prior to us realizing that there was an inconsistency. But because it's still an open permit, our department absolutely has the right to go out there and require that applicant to come back before the design review board, which is what happened. So what we have today is I've provided you an overview of really what was approved by the design review board versus is what's out there today. I did a table and I would say in my recommendation, the changes that occurred are very minimal compared to what the design review board did originally approve. As a matter of fact, it's slightly smaller when we look at the overall sign area. And I also wanna note that because this property is zoned multifamily residential, we do not have a required ground sign size in that district. So I would suggest that the board consider that the design and the overall size is actually slightly smaller than when we originally went to the DRB, that we would have you consider to approve the sign. And I also do wanna note that I think in honesty

  15. And then in terms of a conversation regarding the conversation between the revisions that were submitted to our department and approved, those permits had been approved prior to us realizing that there was an inconsistency. But because it's still an open permit, our department absolutely has the right to go out there and require that applicant to come back before the design review board, which is what happened. So what we have today is I've provided you an overview of really what was approved by the design review board versus is what's out there today. I did a table and I would say in my recommendation, the changes that occurred are very minimal compared to what the design review board did originally approve. As a matter of fact, it's slightly smaller when we look at the overall sign area. And I also wanna note that because this property is zoned multifamily residential, we do not have a required ground sign size in that district. So I would suggest that the board consider that the design and the overall size is actually slightly smaller than when we originally went to the DRB, that we would have you consider to approve the sign. And I also do wanna note that I think in honesty with the applicant and the sign contractor, there was a confusion regarding the roles of the individual constructing the actual base in sign versus the applicant who we've worked with, with Mr. Stein, who's here in the audience, who really was intended to be the installer of just the round logo. So unfortunately, things like this happen sometimes when you have two different contractors doing two different things. Okay, Andrea, let's ask a question. Yeah, go ahead. I remember when we found out about the conflict, I think when they first submitted it, the measurements were incorrect that we were given, if I remember correctly, right? Correct. And then there was an issue with regards to emails. else. that I believe Olivia answered that okayed it. Did you look into those emails? She just responded to me that the revisions he's referring to when he emailed her about revisions were approved and that, I have an email from Olivia on October 1st that says the revisions he's referring to in the below email were approved by Chris on 8-13. On 8-28, an additional review for planning was created in BSNA per our discussion we had in the office and that was after we determined that it was not the accurate size.

  16. And I also do wanna note that I think in honesty with the applicant and the sign contractor, there was a confusion regarding the roles of the individual constructing the actual base in sign versus the applicant who we've worked with, with Mr. Stein, who's here in the audience, who really was intended to be the installer of just the round logo. So unfortunately, things like this happen sometimes when you have two different contractors doing two different things. Okay, Andrea, let's ask a question. Yeah, go ahead. I remember when we found out about the conflict, I think when they first submitted it, the measurements were incorrect that we were given, if I remember correctly, right? Correct. And then there was an issue with regards to emails. else. that I believe Olivia answered that okayed it. Did you look into those emails? She just responded to me that the revisions he's referring to when he emailed her about revisions were approved and that, I have an email from Olivia on October 1st that says the revisions he's referring to in the below email were approved by Chris on 8-13. On 8-28, an additional review for planning was created in BSNA per our discussion we had in the office and that was after we determined that it was not the accurate size. And at that time, we realized that it didn't comply and that's when we brought him back here. So in all honesty, I think this is probably becoming a bigger issue than it traditionally is. This does happen, unfortunately, where things- Well, I'm just trying to clear up the confusion with the email because it sounded originally that Olivia gave him, is it Mr. Stein, permission to go ahead with the sign that was approved? Correct, the sign was approved. But she was confused, but thought she was giving Primrose a temporary occupancy permit. And I stand corrected if that's right, but I presented the design review board meeting and that was my understanding of the time. And so now that I've gone back and done research, I will take that back and say that the sign was approved. Under the sign review process review, which is very common, that's what we do, it was determined that what was installed was different than what was approved, thus necessitating them to come back to the time. Okay. And I know the other issue was they had the flag and I saw the flag was removed. Correct. So, yeah. Thank you. I know Mr. Stein is here if you have anything. I have another question for clarity's sake. So we've got what DRB approved, we have existing sign.

  17. that it was not the accurate size. And at that time, we realized that it didn't comply and that's when we brought him back here. So in all honesty, I think this is probably becoming a bigger issue than it traditionally is. This does happen, unfortunately, where things- Well, I'm just trying to clear up the confusion with the email because it sounded originally that Olivia gave him, is it Mr. Stein, permission to go ahead with the sign that was approved? Correct, the sign was approved. But she was confused, but thought she was giving Primrose a temporary occupancy permit. And I stand corrected if that's right, but I presented the design review board meeting and that was my understanding of the time. And so now that I've gone back and done research, I will take that back and say that the sign was approved. Under the sign review process review, which is very common, that's what we do, it was determined that what was installed was different than what was approved, thus necessitating them to come back to the time. Okay. And I know the other issue was they had the flag and I saw the flag was removed. Correct. So, yeah. Thank you. I know Mr. Stein is here if you have anything. I have another question for clarity's sake. So we've got what DRB approved, we have existing sign. Wouldn't there be a third drawing that shows what, so the DR approval, is that the corrected numbers? Because again, if I recall correctly, the measurements weren't added up correctly. They were stated incorrectly on the, what was submitted. That's why I went out and did my own research and I would be pretty confident to say that the request before you today is what's out there in the field, which I've demonstrated. This is the existing sign. Correct. DRB approval, is that the approval of corrected numbers or the actual numbers that were presented to us at that time? That was actually approved. DR. I guess I'm not understanding your question. Well, if I, I don't, it's not here in the packet now, but there were, if we added up the numbers, they didn't add up to six foot, they added up to a different number. We added the number, you know, height. If we added the numbers, if it didn't add up to seven, four, it added to a different number. DR. I think there was a series of information that was, that there were different numbers, probably three different groups of numbers. I guess I'm not sure what, I guess I'm not sure what you're asking. DR. Well, my point is, is that my, my largest concern is, is that I understand.

  18. So we've got what DRB approved, we have existing sign. Wouldn't there be a third drawing that shows what, so the DR approval, is that the corrected numbers? Because again, if I recall correctly, the measurements weren't added up correctly. They were stated incorrectly on the, what was submitted. That's why I went out and did my own research and I would be pretty confident to say that the request before you today is what's out there in the field, which I've demonstrated. This is the existing sign. Correct. DRB approval, is that the approval of corrected numbers or the actual numbers that were presented to us at that time? That was actually approved. DR. I guess I'm not understanding your question. Well, if I, I don't, it's not here in the packet now, but there were, if we added up the numbers, they didn't add up to six foot, they added up to a different number. We added the number, you know, height. If we added the numbers, if it didn't add up to seven, four, it added to a different number. DR. I think there was a series of information that was, that there were different numbers, probably three different groups of numbers. I guess I'm not sure what, I guess I'm not sure what you're asking. DR. Well, my point is, is that my, my largest concern is, is that I understand. is that my understanding from the last meeting is that the that well we approved it we approved it based upon the incorrect math you know the lines didn't add up to what they claimed they did oh i see what you're saying and that's my issue i understand um we didn't have the correct information we're misinformed um maybe i would have voted differently on the original drb approval if they had properly indicated the numbers okay at this point i guess i'm not really sure the next direction you would like me to take regarding it i'm just trying to make sure i understand that i'm recalling this correctly that we're trying to understand the scope of the design presented to the drb to you and the drb was uh inaccurate in the in just their math was inaccurate it's a significant issue for me okay that i mean i'm not going to sit here at the board table and check the math that across the top the different spots add up to you know 6.4 versus 7.4 um you know and and so do you want to hear from the applicant maybe sure happy to

  19. is that my understanding from the last meeting is that the that well we approved it we approved it based upon the incorrect math you know the lines didn't add up to what they claimed they did oh i see what you're saying and that's my issue i understand um we didn't have the correct information we're misinformed um maybe i would have voted differently on the original drb approval if they had properly indicated the numbers okay at this point i guess i'm not really sure the next direction you would like me to take regarding it i'm just trying to make sure i understand that i'm recalling this correctly that we're trying to understand the scope of the design presented to the drb to you and the drb was uh inaccurate in the in just their math was inaccurate it's a significant issue for me okay that i mean i'm not going to sit here at the board table and check the math that across the top the different spots add up to you know 6.4 versus 7.4 um you know and and so do you want to hear from the applicant maybe sure happy to good afternoon matthew stein with uh science keeps welcome back thank you thank you for having me thank you um sorry we're in the situation um sorry we're in the situation yeah the original drawing um sorry we're in the situation um sorry we're in the situation yeah the original drawing um sorry we're in the situation yeah the original drawing um yeah the original drawing um the original drawing you the original drawing yeah the original drawing Bye. There were a couple different Primrose projects taking place in a couple different cities. The error was on our part. We grabbed the wrong drawing, inserted into this packet, and here we are. So it was clerical error on our part that operationally has definitely been addressed. That's the design report plan. Oh, yes. Thank you. Unfortunately, I think it did become an issue when you had somebody else constructing the actual sign, and you were responsible for the logo. I'll be honest with you, after a lot of research, it was kind of a series of different things. So I'll look. I agree with you, and I did bring that up at the beginning of this process, that our scope of work in this project was to attach those two round logos to a structure being built by somebody else.

  20. good afternoon matthew stein with uh science keeps welcome back thank you thank you for having me thank you um sorry we're in the situation um sorry we're in the situation yeah the original drawing um sorry we're in the situation um sorry we're in the situation yeah the original drawing um sorry we're in the situation yeah the original drawing um yeah the original drawing um the original drawing you the original drawing yeah the original drawing Bye. There were a couple different Primrose projects taking place in a couple different cities. The error was on our part. We grabbed the wrong drawing, inserted into this packet, and here we are. So it was clerical error on our part that operationally has definitely been addressed. That's the design report plan. Oh, yes. Thank you. Unfortunately, I think it did become an issue when you had somebody else constructing the actual sign, and you were responsible for the logo. I'll be honest with you, after a lot of research, it was kind of a series of different things. So I'll look. I agree with you, and I did bring that up at the beginning of this process, that our scope of work in this project was to attach those two round logos to a structure being built by somebody else. And then the other issue you brought up, Andrea, and I don't recall hearing this in the past, had to do with this property that Primrose is on was a multifamily, his own multifamily. Therefore, there's no sign regulations we have on a multi-use property like that. Yeah, I have the sign review here, right here, which states the requirements within the... Okay, I do... Okay, I do... I'm sorry, I stand corrected. One ground sign shall not have an area of no more than 32 square feet per side or 64 square feet of total area shall be permitted. 64? Correct. Okay. And that's within a multifamily zone, which is what that property was zoned originally for? Correct. Okay. All right. So, again, what was a live square footage size allowed? 32 square feet. And the existing sign is? I don't know, Corey, if this is the actual, if this is really 39.68. Is that right, Mr. Stein? This total sign is 39.68 square feet now? I don't have the drawings in front of me. Okay.

  21. And then the other issue you brought up, Andrea, and I don't recall hearing this in the past, had to do with this property that Primrose is on was a multifamily, his own multifamily. Therefore, there's no sign regulations we have on a multi-use property like that. Yeah, I have the sign review here, right here, which states the requirements within the... Okay, I do... Okay, I do... I'm sorry, I stand corrected. One ground sign shall not have an area of no more than 32 square feet per side or 64 square feet of total area shall be permitted. 64? Correct. Okay. And that's within a multifamily zone, which is what that property was zoned originally for? Correct. Okay. All right. So, again, what was a live square footage size allowed? 32 square feet. And the existing sign is? I don't know, Corey, if this is the actual, if this is really 39.68. Is that right, Mr. Stein? This total sign is 39.68 square feet now? I don't have the drawings in front of me. Okay. And did it go to ZZX? Is that 39.68 front and back or just one side? It's supposed to be one side, 32 square feet. Is it double-sided? Yes. And there's a setback we follow there, right? And the signs within the setback, is that it's correctly placed, right? That is correct. Yes. Okay. I stand corrected. It was the wall signs that are not permitted in the research, just in the multiple family. The wall signs on the building. But we approved that already. Correct. When does EBA approve that? Correct. Correct. So that was where I misspoke regarding the provisions related to signage. Okay. Since this ground sign is larger than permitted, does... this need to go to the zba too yes i i i think there was just a lot of serious things that happened this time we had some new i'm not going to make excuses okay that's okay and it was a this this is not a good example of our process it was a very no no no you know confusing we whatever we do here we approve it or whatever recommendation he's got to go back to the zoning board with us okay for the size that's correct thank you okay all right

  22. And did it go to ZZX? Is that 39.68 front and back or just one side? It's supposed to be one side, 32 square feet. Is it double-sided? Yes. And there's a setback we follow there, right? And the signs within the setback, is that it's correctly placed, right? That is correct. Yes. Okay. I stand corrected. It was the wall signs that are not permitted in the research, just in the multiple family. The wall signs on the building. But we approved that already. Correct. When does EBA approve that? Correct. Correct. So that was where I misspoke regarding the provisions related to signage. Okay. Since this ground sign is larger than permitted, does... this need to go to the zba too yes i i i think there was just a lot of serious things that happened this time we had some new i'm not going to make excuses okay that's okay and it was a this this is not a good example of our process it was a very no no no you know confusing we whatever we do here we approve it or whatever recommendation he's got to go back to the zoning board with us okay for the size that's correct thank you okay all right well um yeah i saved my issue my issue was that the drawings were inaccurate were presented with inaccurate drawings and um and so okay but so what i mean the sign is there what are we going to do about it right i mean i've driven i've driven by it a number of times i think it looks fine you can make a motion um just trying to think of what motion i need to make we're going to we're going to approve the sign application i would say the amended sign um subject to zba approval okay so we're going to approve the amended sign um subject to approve the amended sign pending zba approval you you you you you you that's my motion okay support do we need anything more under that andrea are you supporting it because it doesn't look like martin's supporting it yes i'm gonna i'm gonna vote to support it

  23. well um yeah i saved my issue my issue was that the drawings were inaccurate were presented with inaccurate drawings and um and so okay but so what i mean the sign is there what are we going to do about it right i mean i've driven i've driven by it a number of times i think it looks fine you can make a motion um just trying to think of what motion i need to make we're going to we're going to approve the sign application i would say the amended sign um subject to zba approval okay so we're going to approve the amended sign um subject to approve the amended sign pending zba approval you you you you you you that's my motion okay support do we need anything more under that andrea are you supporting it because it doesn't look like martin's supporting it yes i'm gonna i'm gonna vote to support it to send it to zba okay third support most support all all in favor say aye no aye any opposed no okay two to one all right thank you thanks all right site improvements item number b site improvements item number one one one nine one west square lake road and 2709 south telegraph road tmp architects thank you so tmp architects is looking to do site improvements facade improvements to both buildings on their campus they have two addresses here and two parcels so they have the north building here to the north and the south building here they sit within our office district you can see what they say at the intersection of square lake road and telegraph road is that very busy chaotic kind of tri-intersection they sit along our commercial corridor and then they back up to residential to the rear our aerial map confirms our zoning it's consistent there's residential to the rear commercial and office development along telegraph road and so getting into what they're actually proposing and they're proposing exterior site improvements for both the north and south buildings let's see for the north building which is the one we see here

  24. because it doesn't look like martin's supporting it yes i'm gonna i'm gonna vote to support it to send it to zba okay third support most support all all in favor say aye no aye any opposed no okay two to one all right thank you thanks all right site improvements item number b site improvements item number one one one nine one west square lake road and 2709 south telegraph road tmp architects thank you so tmp architects is looking to do site improvements facade improvements to both buildings on their campus they have two addresses here and two parcels so they have the north building here to the north and the south building here they sit within our office district you can see what they say at the intersection of square lake road and telegraph road is that very busy chaotic kind of tri-intersection they sit along our commercial corridor and then they back up to residential to the rear our aerial map confirms our zoning it's consistent there's residential to the rear commercial and office development along telegraph road and so getting into what they're actually proposing and they're proposing exterior site improvements for both the north and south buildings let's see for the north building which is the one we see here the one that kind of looks like it used to be a schoolhouse and then was added on to. They are proposing to remove the existing asphalt roof and replace it with a standing seam zinc roof and graphite gray finish. They're cladding the new elevator shaft and zinc diamond shingles. They're replacing the existing cement fascia with custom formed zinc panels. All existing windows are being replaced with new energy efficient aluminum windows. The existing stucco will be cleaned and repainted in white. Existing steel beams and columns will be will remain and be repainted. A new painted metal screen will conceal rooftop mechanical units and a new concrete stair and landing are proposed for the north elevation and so that work in detail is provided in your packet outlining all the facade changes that they are proposing. It is mostly materials and upgrades. And wasn't there weren't they raising the roof or something wasn't there a roof line that was going up a little bit or something? They might be able to speak better on that. Is that right? Yeah. Come on up and introduce yourself. I was here previously. Yeah. Hi. That was when we were just replacing the roof. You can introduce yourself. If you could introduce yourself. I'm Bill Weinrock with TMP Architects. Thank you. We were here a month or two ago. We were replacing the flat roof. Yeah. That's part of the work that's taking place. So we got the roof warm or dry and now we're trying to replace the exterior facade.

  25. the one that kind of looks like it used to be a schoolhouse and then was added on to. They are proposing to remove the existing asphalt roof and replace it with a standing seam zinc roof and graphite gray finish. They're cladding the new elevator shaft and zinc diamond shingles. They're replacing the existing cement fascia with custom formed zinc panels. All existing windows are being replaced with new energy efficient aluminum windows. The existing stucco will be cleaned and repainted in white. Existing steel beams and columns will be will remain and be repainted. A new painted metal screen will conceal rooftop mechanical units and a new concrete stair and landing are proposed for the north elevation and so that work in detail is provided in your packet outlining all the facade changes that they are proposing. It is mostly materials and upgrades. And wasn't there weren't they raising the roof or something wasn't there a roof line that was going up a little bit or something? They might be able to speak better on that. Is that right? Yeah. Come on up and introduce yourself. I was here previously. Yeah. Hi. That was when we were just replacing the roof. You can introduce yourself. If you could introduce yourself. I'm Bill Weinrock with TMP Architects. Thank you. We were here a month or two ago. We were replacing the flat roof. Yeah. That's part of the work that's taking place. So we got the roof warm or dry and now we're trying to replace the exterior facade. It looks like it's going to really look great. It's going to look fantastic. Yeah. How many years have you been at that location? Uh, we've been there since 59. That's wonderful. Congratulations. not me personally no all right so continuing to the south building once my computer catches up all right so for the south building improvements focus on enhancing the building street presence and screening on the south property line they are constructing a new wood framed canopy supported by four by fours pressure treated posts the canopy roof will have zinc metal panels consistent with the north building the canopy will incorporate an electric heat mat and integrated lighting for functionality and comfort the other big change to the south building is replacement of the screening fence along the perimeter of the property the fence posts will remain and the fence location will remain they're simply swapping out the brick and they're going to be replacing it with so i believe it's wood wood channels sorry a wood composite so there will be a few variances

  26. taking place. So we got the roof warm or dry and now we're trying to replace the exterior facade. It looks like it's going to really look great. It's going to look fantastic. Yeah. How many years have you been at that location? Uh, we've been there since 59. That's wonderful. Congratulations. not me personally no all right so continuing to the south building once my computer catches up all right so for the south building improvements focus on enhancing the building street presence and screening on the south property line they are constructing a new wood framed canopy supported by four by fours pressure treated posts the canopy roof will have zinc metal panels consistent with the north building the canopy will incorporate an electric heat mat and integrated lighting for functionality and comfort the other big change to the south building is replacement of the screening fence along the perimeter of the property the fence posts will remain and the fence location will remain they're simply swapping out the brick and they're going to be replacing it with so i believe it's wood wood channels sorry a wood composite so there will be a few variances needed the fence does extend into the front yard here at this point so any portion of the fence in the front yard will require approval by the zba and then this is actually not part of their request i confirm that with the applicant but they are in the future it looks like proposing several items out in the lawn some improvements some areas for their employees that most of those items will require zba approval but they're not part of this request today okay and so that's it for my presentation thank you if i could i would ask patrick from dual to come up and talk about the um the landscape design that dual has been working on as part of the site improvement um as it's um i think it's pretty pretty impressive and comprehensive so if you'd like to share thank you andrea my name is patrick funke with dual landscape architecture we're working with tmp architecture on developing an outdoor entertainment or really not entertainment outdoor facility for their employees and their occasional guests to use the space will consist of a permeable paving uh terrace patio with a seating for picnic tables

  27. so i believe it's wood wood channels sorry a wood composite so there will be a few variances needed the fence does extend into the front yard here at this point so any portion of the fence in the front yard will require approval by the zba and then this is actually not part of their request i confirm that with the applicant but they are in the future it looks like proposing several items out in the lawn some improvements some areas for their employees that most of those items will require zba approval but they're not part of this request today okay and so that's it for my presentation thank you if i could i would ask patrick from dual to come up and talk about the um the landscape design that dual has been working on as part of the site improvement um as it's um i think it's pretty pretty impressive and comprehensive so if you'd like to share thank you andrea my name is patrick funke with dual landscape architecture we're working with tmp architecture on developing an outdoor entertainment or really not entertainment outdoor facility for their employees and their occasional guests to use the space will consist of a permeable paving uh terrace patio with a seating for picnic tables leisure and some potential workspaces or work pods we have in over one small overhead pergola uh centered on the work pod area right where your red arrow is that will require um zba approval we're doing that for you know on sunny days so we they can use their laptops outside we have some exposed aggregate concrete seat walls and curbs proposed as well as a casual uh decomposed granite pathway system that meanders between the curb rock outcropping seat rocks and the seat wall uh we do have an open space of lawn and also proposing uh a fire feature for evening use and a water feature to help disguise the noise along Telegraph. They're a very busy thoroughfare, as everybody's aware. And probably one of the most important things is the necessity for some security fencing. We're using a four-foot high aluminum picket fence, black, so it's transparent, weaving in and out of the existing trees and the proposed evergreens to create a buffer from Telegraph Road and the surrounding parking to make this just feel like a real oasis.

  28. the space will consist of a permeable paving uh terrace patio with a seating for picnic tables leisure and some potential workspaces or work pods we have in over one small overhead pergola uh centered on the work pod area right where your red arrow is that will require um zba approval we're doing that for you know on sunny days so we they can use their laptops outside we have some exposed aggregate concrete seat walls and curbs proposed as well as a casual uh decomposed granite pathway system that meanders between the curb rock outcropping seat rocks and the seat wall uh we do have an open space of lawn and also proposing uh a fire feature for evening use and a water feature to help disguise the noise along Telegraph. They're a very busy thoroughfare, as everybody's aware. And probably one of the most important things is the necessity for some security fencing. We're using a four-foot high aluminum picket fence, black, so it's transparent, weaving in and out of the existing trees and the proposed evergreens to create a buffer from Telegraph Road and the surrounding parking to make this just feel like a real oasis. So I think it's a great example of, you know, a firm investing in their employees to promote the outdoors, and we're excited to be part of it. Nice. Looks great. So I'm not sure what the discussion was. In my understanding, this is part of we met yesterday. This is part of their request before you today. Oh, my bad. I apologize. I think it looks great, but I have a question just for my own informational purposes. What's decomposed granite? Sounds impossible. So a decomposed granite is a very fine granite. It's smaller than your pinky fingernail. What we do is we put on, like, a road base, a 21AA below that. And then the top two inches, there's multitude of colors available, but it's real fine. And there's actually a stabilizer that is in it that is activated with water so that they don't track it into necessarily their own. office but it's just meant to be casual and natural a little bit more sustainable it's permeable as well so thank you so with this request that we would just include that the defense as cory stated the fencing the fire pit they are proposing a gas burning fire pit for their for their users

  29. to create a buffer from Telegraph Road and the surrounding parking to make this just feel like a real oasis. So I think it's a great example of, you know, a firm investing in their employees to promote the outdoors, and we're excited to be part of it. Nice. Looks great. So I'm not sure what the discussion was. In my understanding, this is part of we met yesterday. This is part of their request before you today. Oh, my bad. I apologize. I think it looks great, but I have a question just for my own informational purposes. What's decomposed granite? Sounds impossible. So a decomposed granite is a very fine granite. It's smaller than your pinky fingernail. What we do is we put on, like, a road base, a 21AA below that. And then the top two inches, there's multitude of colors available, but it's real fine. And there's actually a stabilizer that is in it that is activated with water so that they don't track it into necessarily their own. office but it's just meant to be casual and natural a little bit more sustainable it's permeable as well so thank you so with this request that we would just include that the defense as cory stated the fencing the fire pit they are proposing a gas burning fire pit for their for their users they are also proposing a water feature and a grill located closer to the building so because of the location of those accessory structures within the frontages that will require a zoning board of appeals but i would i think that that's just based on obviously the layout of the property that necessitates the requirement of those approvals but um does this need to go to the board of trustees no because it's not a building addition they're literally just doing exterior work um if they were adding any occupiable space or doing an addition then we would take it on through a site plan approval process but in this instance these are um site improvements we look at that okay do we need to put any uh timing restrictions on the use i would have because i guess because it abuts residential we could ask the um well the outdoor space actually abuts well i'll have um you speak to the hours yeah dave you want to go ahead and do that i suppose i can do that yeah hi everybody i'm dave larson chairman of tmp and been here been with tmp for 40 years believe it or not so um we will be using this during business hours primarily now occasionally we might have a even you

  30. the fencing the fire pit they are proposing a gas burning fire pit for their for their users they are also proposing a water feature and a grill located closer to the building so because of the location of those accessory structures within the frontages that will require a zoning board of appeals but i would i think that that's just based on obviously the layout of the property that necessitates the requirement of those approvals but um does this need to go to the board of trustees no because it's not a building addition they're literally just doing exterior work um if they were adding any occupiable space or doing an addition then we would take it on through a site plan approval process but in this instance these are um site improvements we look at that okay do we need to put any uh timing restrictions on the use i would have because i guess because it abuts residential we could ask the um well the outdoor space actually abuts well i'll have um you speak to the hours yeah dave you want to go ahead and do that i suppose i can do that yeah hi everybody i'm dave larson chairman of tmp and been here been with tmp for 40 years believe it or not so um we will be using this during business hours primarily now occasionally we might have a even you party or something of that nature but you know those are generally pretty low-key you know events it's a well screened from the neighbors you know you cannot really see this courtyard or outdoor space from the neighborhoods immediately adjacent so we feel that if you stand out there it's a very private environment right even as it is right now so you can see you know just yeah thanks to the aerial you know that corner that quadrant is pretty isolated I'm trying to find that is there a plan that shows what the as-built is going to be on in this in that same shape oh they're asking you're asking for okay so this it's it's really against telegraph yeah it's far away correct okay and you're just basically it's just for your employees to use and then you might have a work event that you would hold there yeah that's it yeah yeah looks

  31. party or something of that nature but you know those are generally pretty low-key you know events it's a well screened from the neighbors you know you cannot really see this courtyard or outdoor space from the neighborhoods immediately adjacent so we feel that if you stand out there it's a very private environment right even as it is right now so you can see you know just yeah thanks to the aerial you know that corner that quadrant is pretty isolated I'm trying to find that is there a plan that shows what the as-built is going to be on in this in that same shape oh they're asking you're asking for okay so this it's it's really against telegraph yeah it's far away correct okay and you're just basically it's just for your employees to use and then you might have a work event that you would hold there yeah that's it yeah yeah looks beautiful will the fence totally enclose that from people who may walk in off the road okay it's only four feet it's just If you'd like to go back to the podium, we can hear you on the recording. Thank you. Thank you, Patrick. Yeah, so the area they're looking to use the outside is more really adjacent just solely to between their two buildings facing Telegraph. Got it. Okay. Does it go to planning, too, or just CBA? No, this is just a site improvement. This is just exterior site improvements and a facade improvement. So besides us, it goes to? CBA. This would be it. This is it. Oh, ZBA. I'm sorry. We are prepared, Andrea, per our meeting yesterday. We have our ZBA application to turn in following this meeting, assume this is a favorable vote. Okay. Sounds good. I'm happy to make a motion. Go ahead. I make a motion to approve the building facade improvements and the landscape architecture as presented.

  32. might have a work event that you would hold there yeah that's it yeah yeah looks beautiful will the fence totally enclose that from people who may walk in off the road okay it's only four feet it's just If you'd like to go back to the podium, we can hear you on the recording. Thank you. Thank you, Patrick. Yeah, so the area they're looking to use the outside is more really adjacent just solely to between their two buildings facing Telegraph. Got it. Okay. Does it go to planning, too, or just CBA? No, this is just a site improvement. This is just exterior site improvements and a facade improvement. So besides us, it goes to? CBA. This would be it. This is it. Oh, ZBA. I'm sorry. We are prepared, Andrea, per our meeting yesterday. We have our ZBA application to turn in following this meeting, assume this is a favorable vote. Okay. Sounds good. I'm happy to make a motion. Go ahead. I make a motion to approve the building facade improvements and the landscape architecture as presented. And send it to the ZBA. And forward to the ZBA for further consideration. Okay. Support. All in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Pass three, nothing. Thank you. Good luck, gentlemen. Looks like a wonderful project. Item number two, 2527 South Telegraph Road, Verizon. So this is very simple. They are adding a heat pump to the roof. This is where the property sits within our zoning map, very close to where we were just discussing. What are they doing on the roof? They're adding a heat pump. Okay. Yeah. So we can just cut to the chase if you want. The heat pump will be a little. located right here, right there. It is screened with parapets on the front. Okay, and does this need to go to the ZBA? Doesn't need ZBA, just needs your approval. It is not visible from the rear. I circled the building myself to confirm. Okay, I'll make a motion we approve and submit it. Support, all in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed, passes three, nothing. Thank you. Item number three, 4104 West Maple Road, the Goldsmith Gallery. Hello again, board. This is another simple request for a roof-mounted mechanical replacement at the Goldsmith Gallery on West Maple Road.

  33. And send it to the ZBA. And forward to the ZBA for further consideration. Okay. Support. All in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Pass three, nothing. Thank you. Good luck, gentlemen. Looks like a wonderful project. Item number two, 2527 South Telegraph Road, Verizon. So this is very simple. They are adding a heat pump to the roof. This is where the property sits within our zoning map, very close to where we were just discussing. What are they doing on the roof? They're adding a heat pump. Okay. Yeah. So we can just cut to the chase if you want. The heat pump will be a little. located right here, right there. It is screened with parapets on the front. Okay, and does this need to go to the ZBA? Doesn't need ZBA, just needs your approval. It is not visible from the rear. I circled the building myself to confirm. Okay, I'll make a motion we approve and submit it. Support, all in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed, passes three, nothing. Thank you. Item number three, 4104 West Maple Road, the Goldsmith Gallery. Hello again, board. This is another simple request for a roof-mounted mechanical replacement at the Goldsmith Gallery on West Maple Road. The roof-mounted mechanicals will be located in the rear of the building facing the parking lot. This is a photograph from the roof. The mechanicals are already screened. And they're just replacing it. Yes. And then we have the contractor, Paul, here, who can answer any technical questions. Probably what's been there, I'm sure. That looks pretty good. And then here are some photos from a site visit. And you can see the screening right there. That's from the rear of the building. Sure. I don't have any questions. Michael? Okay, make a motion. I move to approve as presented. Support. All in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed, passes three, nothing. Thank you, good luck. item c site plans item number one four three zero zero three woodward avenue the mobile gas station all right so this is a site you should all be very familiar with by this point it's at the intersection of square lake and woodward see where it sits within our aerial it's in a commercial corridor residential is well tucked away from it this has been before you i believe a few times so you're familiar with the gas station that's under construction looks great i think it's open though yep it is open so all that they're seeking to do is add a liquor license because of that they have

  34. The roof-mounted mechanicals will be located in the rear of the building facing the parking lot. This is a photograph from the roof. The mechanicals are already screened. And they're just replacing it. Yes. And then we have the contractor, Paul, here, who can answer any technical questions. Probably what's been there, I'm sure. That looks pretty good. And then here are some photos from a site visit. And you can see the screening right there. That's from the rear of the building. Sure. I don't have any questions. Michael? Okay, make a motion. I move to approve as presented. Support. All in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed, passes three, nothing. Thank you, good luck. item c site plans item number one four three zero zero three woodward avenue the mobile gas station all right so this is a site you should all be very familiar with by this point it's at the intersection of square lake and woodward see where it sits within our aerial it's in a commercial corridor residential is well tucked away from it this has been before you i believe a few times so you're familiar with the gas station that's under construction looks great i think it's open though yep it is open so all that they're seeking to do is add a liquor license because of that they have to be routed as though it were a site plan and so that's why it's coming before you today but there are no proposed alterations to the design of the facility but i would like to go over the requirements for a liquor license just to clarify that this property does qualify so to get a liquor license in this locator for a gas station you have to be zoned b3 which the property is zoned your property has to be over 0.51 acres this property is 0.96 the building size has to be over 2 000 square feet this one is 3 700 and there cannot be any adjacent residential there is none there cannot be a drive through there is none and there cannot be auto repair on site there is none so they qualify for liquor license yeah i think this has been in the plan and the works for a while and here we are yep that's a great looking station glad to see it open any questions so this will go through the planning commission as well as township board because this is affiliated with retail package liquor as well as i do the applicant has made up has submitted a township liquor license application as well yep okay thank you I moved to approve as presented support all in favor say aye aye any opposed passes three to nothing thank you okay item number two four two nine three one Woodward Avenue Western Market all

  35. yep it is open so all that they're seeking to do is add a liquor license because of that they have to be routed as though it were a site plan and so that's why it's coming before you today but there are no proposed alterations to the design of the facility but i would like to go over the requirements for a liquor license just to clarify that this property does qualify so to get a liquor license in this locator for a gas station you have to be zoned b3 which the property is zoned your property has to be over 0.51 acres this property is 0.96 the building size has to be over 2 000 square feet this one is 3 700 and there cannot be any adjacent residential there is none there cannot be a drive through there is none and there cannot be auto repair on site there is none so they qualify for liquor license yeah i think this has been in the plan and the works for a while and here we are yep that's a great looking station glad to see it open any questions so this will go through the planning commission as well as township board because this is affiliated with retail package liquor as well as i do the applicant has made up has submitted a township liquor license application as well yep okay thank you I moved to approve as presented support all in favor say aye aye any opposed passes three to nothing thank you okay item number two four two nine three one Woodward Avenue Western Market all right so same intersection is before but now on the south side where there used to be a Rite Aid the applicant is proposing to convert that space into a grocery store because of that it's being routed through as a site plan for a change in use so I can clarify that the existing building is going to be minimally altered it meets the existing setbacks and will continue to meet the setbacks and I can go over what changes they are proposing so give me a second to the computer handles these very slowly but I'm gonna move to the renderings because I think those are the most useful for your purposes this is really going to be a great addition to our community I agree Wow and we can look at those more later but I really want to focus it's really good I saw okay yeah all right so they're taking the existing overhang there's a likeness that I will be charging for okay sorry career we're good you're good so they're going to renovate the the former Rite Aid it is consistent with the zoning for the district B3 allows for grocery stores

  36. okay item number two four two nine three one Woodward Avenue Western Market all right so same intersection is before but now on the south side where there used to be a Rite Aid the applicant is proposing to convert that space into a grocery store because of that it's being routed through as a site plan for a change in use so I can clarify that the existing building is going to be minimally altered it meets the existing setbacks and will continue to meet the setbacks and I can go over what changes they are proposing so give me a second to the computer handles these very slowly but I'm gonna move to the renderings because I think those are the most useful for your purposes this is really going to be a great addition to our community I agree Wow and we can look at those more later but I really want to focus it's really good I saw okay yeah all right so they're taking the existing overhang there's a likeness that I will be charging for okay sorry career we're good you're good so they're going to renovate the the former Rite Aid it is consistent with the zoning for the district B3 allows for grocery stores They will be requesting a liquor license as part of this, so they're being routed through as a retail liquor package, I believe it is called. But it is a grocery store that they are proposing. In terms of exterior alterations, they're going to be recladding the facade and modernizing it with contemporary materials. The main entrance canopy is going to be redesigned for increased visibility. Let's see, so they're going to be adding an outdoor market zone under here, under the canopy. It's going to be an outdoor dedicated space for produce and cart area. You can see the cart storage will occur off to the side here. Other improvements include increased accessibility, ADA requirements. So that's a huge improvement for the property. They're going to be adding this light column here as a design feature. And then the other... What did you call it? It's a light column, I believe it lights up. Column? They're light columns along these columns. They're linear old LEDs that light up. We'll have a chance for you to come up and... After Core is done, you can come up and talk. Okay, so... So it's a column... So it's not actually a column? It's actually a column and it lights up with LEDs. Oh, I see. Okay, so it's actually a column and it lights up. Yeah, it's not like a light beam.

  37. They will be requesting a liquor license as part of this, so they're being routed through as a retail liquor package, I believe it is called. But it is a grocery store that they are proposing. In terms of exterior alterations, they're going to be recladding the facade and modernizing it with contemporary materials. The main entrance canopy is going to be redesigned for increased visibility. Let's see, so they're going to be adding an outdoor market zone under here, under the canopy. It's going to be an outdoor dedicated space for produce and cart area. You can see the cart storage will occur off to the side here. Other improvements include increased accessibility, ADA requirements. So that's a huge improvement for the property. They're going to be adding this light column here as a design feature. And then the other... What did you call it? It's a light column, I believe it lights up. Column? They're light columns along these columns. They're linear old LEDs that light up. We'll have a chance for you to come up and... After Core is done, you can come up and talk. Okay, so... So it's a column... So it's not actually a column? It's actually a column and it lights up with LEDs. Oh, I see. Okay, so it's actually a column and it lights up. Yeah, it's not like a light beam. Sorry for not being clear. It's basically a column light that gets attached to the front of those columns there. They're small in scale, but they're long and it just illuminates the front. They're shielded from any outward light. Right? So basically... glows the front of the built the building and he's gonna introduce yourself yeah so my name is Steve Savagio I'm co-owner I'm partners with my son Steven Savagio so sorry for the confusion with all the Steve's and sorry for the confusion with all the Savagio's we are related to the Savagio's who are south of us off of Telegraph so we're cousins although we spell our name differently we're s-e-l-v-a-g-g-i-o I know it doesn't really matter but I just want to give an explanation to who we are we we've been located in downtown Ferndale for 43 years we've got a pretty good track record we've sustained through all the highs and the lows and we feel very confident about this new location which is actually going to be a rebranding for us it's going to be called nourish by Western Market and so what you see there on the sign it's going to be the same in scale it's going to look a little different we're in the middle of rebranding so but it's the name of the store is going to be called nourish by Western Market so mr. Savagio that light you're talking about that beam have you

  38. Yeah, it's not like a light beam. Sorry for not being clear. It's basically a column light that gets attached to the front of those columns there. They're small in scale, but they're long and it just illuminates the front. They're shielded from any outward light. Right? So basically... glows the front of the built the building and he's gonna introduce yourself yeah so my name is Steve Savagio I'm co-owner I'm partners with my son Steven Savagio so sorry for the confusion with all the Steve's and sorry for the confusion with all the Savagio's we are related to the Savagio's who are south of us off of Telegraph so we're cousins although we spell our name differently we're s-e-l-v-a-g-g-i-o I know it doesn't really matter but I just want to give an explanation to who we are we we've been located in downtown Ferndale for 43 years we've got a pretty good track record we've sustained through all the highs and the lows and we feel very confident about this new location which is actually going to be a rebranding for us it's going to be called nourish by Western Market and so what you see there on the sign it's going to be the same in scale it's going to look a little different we're in the middle of rebranding so but it's the name of the store is going to be called nourish by Western Market so mr. Savagio that light you're talking about that beam have you installed that in your store in Ferndale have not have not this was brought to us by by design group Ron and Roman who was our original designers we really like them a lot they brought a lot of good good things to it but we have changed designers in the midstream and we're now with a design firm called h2g which is the design firm which we've all said yet we like this and basically what they are just probably I don't have exact dimensions, but they're narrow and long along the front of those columns. So as you're driving by, and the letters up on the sign illuminate, there's not a light on the sign, but they just... The letters themselves illuminate? They illuminate. Yes. They're LED illuminating. Are we being asked to approve the sign? No. So if I could continue my presentation. Yeah, go ahead. Oh, sorry, Corey. You're good. So one of the things I wanted to talk about with the signage, the applicant's proposing these three signs. We spoke yesterday. This is close to what they want, but not exactly. So they're going to be coming back later. For the signage. It conforms to the square footage, but what you see on the sign is going to change a little bit because of the rebranding. And we're trying hard... So currently, we feel we have an identity crisis. Western market's oftenly confused with Westbourne market, and they're both great markets.

  39. Western Market so mr. Savagio that light you're talking about that beam have you installed that in your store in Ferndale have not have not this was brought to us by by design group Ron and Roman who was our original designers we really like them a lot they brought a lot of good good things to it but we have changed designers in the midstream and we're now with a design firm called h2g which is the design firm which we've all said yet we like this and basically what they are just probably I don't have exact dimensions, but they're narrow and long along the front of those columns. So as you're driving by, and the letters up on the sign illuminate, there's not a light on the sign, but they just... The letters themselves illuminate? They illuminate. Yes. They're LED illuminating. Are we being asked to approve the sign? No. So if I could continue my presentation. Yeah, go ahead. Oh, sorry, Corey. You're good. So one of the things I wanted to talk about with the signage, the applicant's proposing these three signs. We spoke yesterday. This is close to what they want, but not exactly. So they're going to be coming back later. For the signage. It conforms to the square footage, but what you see on the sign is going to change a little bit because of the rebranding. And we're trying hard... So currently, we feel we have an identity crisis. Western market's oftenly confused with Westbourne market, and they're both great markets. We like Westbourne. They're friendly competitors, but we want to stand out and be known as nourished by Western market, so that we know that this is an upscale market that caters to people who are health oriented, who want better products. We're not a conventional grocer, we're what we call a specialty grocer, and we concentrate on being special. And this is our first out to change the brand. We have hopes to extend that to other locations eventually. This is number two, but it's also number two with a different brand. And we plan to rebrand our nine mile location, but not yet. We want to get this one off the ground and be... real strong with the Nourish brand. Okay, thank you, Mr. Silvaggio. Okay, Cory, I'm sorry, you want to go through your list now? Just want to finish up real quick. So signage will be routed back later. The other exterior alteration that I wanted to draw your attention to is at the rear of the property. Yes. So there's this kind of yellow railing ramp area. This is all proposed to be removed. So they're going to be getting rid of this kind of ugly stuff. And they're going to have a truck backup here. This is going to be their loading zone. It's going to be a cleaner look. And then it's going to back up to a raised platform with a roof over it for

  40. Western market's oftenly confused with Westbourne market, and they're both great markets. We like Westbourne. They're friendly competitors, but we want to stand out and be known as nourished by Western market, so that we know that this is an upscale market that caters to people who are health oriented, who want better products. We're not a conventional grocer, we're what we call a specialty grocer, and we concentrate on being special. And this is our first out to change the brand. We have hopes to extend that to other locations eventually. This is number two, but it's also number two with a different brand. And we plan to rebrand our nine mile location, but not yet. We want to get this one off the ground and be... real strong with the Nourish brand. Okay, thank you, Mr. Silvaggio. Okay, Cory, I'm sorry, you want to go through your list now? Just want to finish up real quick. So signage will be routed back later. The other exterior alteration that I wanted to draw your attention to is at the rear of the property. Yes. So there's this kind of yellow railing ramp area. This is all proposed to be removed. So they're going to be getting rid of this kind of ugly stuff. And they're going to have a truck backup here. This is going to be their loading zone. It's going to be a cleaner look. And then it's going to back up to a raised platform with a roof over it for loading and unloading on site. But they will be getting rid of a lot of this back here. The other thing I wanted to draw your attention to is alterations to the facade. They're going to be increasing the window size right there. And then lastly, I wanted to clarify that since the use is going from a Rite Aid to a grocery store, from a parking count perspective, we consider that same for same. So there's no change to the parking. Their parking lot is grandfathered. And then you had some pictures of it inside the store. Do you want to go through them a little slower this time? Yeah. Sure. You don't like it the other way? Yeah. Okay. So that's the wine department. And it looks like there's a bar there. It's a concierge desk, although this is being revised as we're speaking. The concierge desk is going to be on the end of the display. You can't see from this view. And the actual, what we've done through probably 25 different design meetings is the wine and the liquor are going to change. places we we feel that we want to have liquor but we know liquor is on the downswing as far as consumption so we're downsizing the size of the liquor and expanding the the size of the wine the wine's going up the wine the wine is the the footprint of the wine is going up okay but

  41. And then it's going to back up to a raised platform with a roof over it for loading and unloading on site. But they will be getting rid of a lot of this back here. The other thing I wanted to draw your attention to is alterations to the facade. They're going to be increasing the window size right there. And then lastly, I wanted to clarify that since the use is going from a Rite Aid to a grocery store, from a parking count perspective, we consider that same for same. So there's no change to the parking. Their parking lot is grandfathered. And then you had some pictures of it inside the store. Do you want to go through them a little slower this time? Yeah. Sure. You don't like it the other way? Yeah. Okay. So that's the wine department. And it looks like there's a bar there. It's a concierge desk, although this is being revised as we're speaking. The concierge desk is going to be on the end of the display. You can't see from this view. And the actual, what we've done through probably 25 different design meetings is the wine and the liquor are going to change. places we we feel that we want to have liquor but we know liquor is on the downswing as far as consumption so we're downsizing the size of the liquor and expanding the the size of the wine the wine's going up the wine the wine is the the footprint of the wine is going up okay but currently what you see is the liquor is going to go there in a smaller format and the wine's going to go on on the other side and it's still in development and then would there be like would you be hosting events in that at all or no this is no we have what we have is like currently we do like wednesday wine tastings they're free we are allowed to taste three one out sam samplings but the events themselves as as events paid events no they're not planned for this space okay and then what time will the wine tasting usually they're they're from three to five i'm sorry four to seven four to seven yep and that's what we currently do um they're fun they're nice people get to explore new wines they don't have to pay they're they're free in there we have a separate license for that it's a tasting license so just to clear i'm sorry i just want to touch upon the liquor license quickly um this is being processed again as a retail package um for consumption of and currently their application into the clerk's office is for an sdm license which is for beer and wine however similar to what we did exactly for nino savaggios meninos came to the township they went through the site plan process they went before the township board for approval and at that time um they they know

  42. wine's going up the wine the wine is the the footprint of the wine is going up okay but currently what you see is the liquor is going to go there in a smaller format and the wine's going to go on on the other side and it's still in development and then would there be like would you be hosting events in that at all or no this is no we have what we have is like currently we do like wednesday wine tastings they're free we are allowed to taste three one out sam samplings but the events themselves as as events paid events no they're not planned for this space okay and then what time will the wine tasting usually they're they're from three to five i'm sorry four to seven four to seven yep and that's what we currently do um they're fun they're nice people get to explore new wines they don't have to pay they're they're free in there we have a separate license for that it's a tasting license so just to clear i'm sorry i just want to touch upon the liquor license quickly um this is being processed again as a retail package um for consumption of and currently their application into the clerk's office is for an sdm license which is for beer and wine however similar to what we did exactly for nino savaggios meninos came to the township they went through the site plan process they went before the township board for approval and at that time um they they know that they were going to seek an SDD license of liquor so we're going to process this the same way and in the fact that they've applied for their SDM they have an intention of getting SDD so if it goes through the gets approval from the board they don't have to come back to you because their approval will be granted as part of a retail package it so just wanted to clarify the two licenses okay and how many square feet will this be this is 14,300 of the interior there's a small space outside I'm not exactly sure the square foot if I had to guess it's probably 500 square feet on the outside Cory do you have anything else you'd like to present that's it for me thank you sorry we were back and forth a couple quick questions so I I'm in the Ferndale store at least once a month oh nice it's great it's a great store I love the meat counter in particular with the you know like you know it's a lot of places you go and it's just came in on this prepackaged it so we do a lot of your own work so we have plans of making it similar to the nine mile location we have the exact same footprint of service counter we're trying to add a little bit of packaged meat only for convenience only people like to just walk up and grab so we try to identify the most you know used items and package those so people can come in and grab them and go so they don't have to wait in service back I would say

  43. that they were going to seek an SDD license of liquor so we're going to process this the same way and in the fact that they've applied for their SDM they have an intention of getting SDD so if it goes through the gets approval from the board they don't have to come back to you because their approval will be granted as part of a retail package it so just wanted to clarify the two licenses okay and how many square feet will this be this is 14,300 of the interior there's a small space outside I'm not exactly sure the square foot if I had to guess it's probably 500 square feet on the outside Cory do you have anything else you'd like to present that's it for me thank you sorry we were back and forth a couple quick questions so I I'm in the Ferndale store at least once a month oh nice it's great it's a great store I love the meat counter in particular with the you know like you know it's a lot of places you go and it's just came in on this prepackaged it so we do a lot of your own work so we have plans of making it similar to the nine mile location we have the exact same footprint of service counter we're trying to add a little bit of packaged meat only for convenience only people like to just walk up and grab so we try to identify the most you know used items and package those so people can come in and grab them and go so they don't have to wait in service back I would say during COVID or even post COVID we made a constant decision in Ferndale to almost remove most of all of our service cases except for the meat department and the meat part we kept it's really popular for us We're one of the, I wouldn't say the few, but we feel that we execute a very high level of our meat counter. People like it a lot. We don't want to remove that particular. But in this location, we've actually added service cases comparatively to Nine Mile because we feel that we want to present some service but not so much where it's a burden on labor. Labor is a very tough cookie to cut currently. We want to keep a nice balance. So all the staff there are really good, but the meat counter staff in particular are really good. As a consumer, I appreciate their advice. I guarantee the market around here will similarly like it too. You know this. That's why you're investing all this money. That's what we're shooting for, to cater to the clientele that give them what they want. And honestly, in the 43 years that we've been in Ferndale, we've changed a bunch of times. I'll tell you why we've changed. Listen to the customer and try to give them what they want. And what we think that they want sometimes doesn't always match. But as we find out and experience, you know, what they're looking for, we're easy to pivot and change and make things, you know, better.

  44. come in and grab them and go so they don't have to wait in service back I would say during COVID or even post COVID we made a constant decision in Ferndale to almost remove most of all of our service cases except for the meat department and the meat part we kept it's really popular for us We're one of the, I wouldn't say the few, but we feel that we execute a very high level of our meat counter. People like it a lot. We don't want to remove that particular. But in this location, we've actually added service cases comparatively to Nine Mile because we feel that we want to present some service but not so much where it's a burden on labor. Labor is a very tough cookie to cut currently. We want to keep a nice balance. So all the staff there are really good, but the meat counter staff in particular are really good. As a consumer, I appreciate their advice. I guarantee the market around here will similarly like it too. You know this. That's why you're investing all this money. That's what we're shooting for, to cater to the clientele that give them what they want. And honestly, in the 43 years that we've been in Ferndale, we've changed a bunch of times. I'll tell you why we've changed. Listen to the customer and try to give them what they want. And what we think that they want sometimes doesn't always match. But as we find out and experience, you know, what they're looking for, we're easy to pivot and change and make things, you know, better. And that's our goal is to keep improving. I look forward to having it here in the community and it's going to do really well. Thanks for coming here. I have one question. Do we have any regulations around the food outside? When they do open and they do want to set up their outdoor sales, we do have the requirement. I'm just like. Nino's and other outdoor sales to a file for a special event application that comes before the design review board and what that does is we basically just take a look at the layout and make sure our fire marshal has a chance to look at it making sure that you have enough space and that it's it's safe and accessible so that would just be an application to for a special event for outdoor sales that that's the way that we can kind of give an oversight locally to outdoor sales so thank you for that and then that is perpetuated as long as it doesn't change if I could speak to the outdoor sales we put the outdoor sales for a reason it's actually a drawing card for people driving by and saying oh must be a market there even though you can clearly see that it's a market so in our experience in Ferndale whenever we put things outside it attracts people to come in they like it a lot especially during the spring and summer you know

  45. But as we find out and experience, you know, what they're looking for, we're easy to pivot and change and make things, you know, better. And that's our goal is to keep improving. I look forward to having it here in the community and it's going to do really well. Thanks for coming here. I have one question. Do we have any regulations around the food outside? When they do open and they do want to set up their outdoor sales, we do have the requirement. I'm just like. Nino's and other outdoor sales to a file for a special event application that comes before the design review board and what that does is we basically just take a look at the layout and make sure our fire marshal has a chance to look at it making sure that you have enough space and that it's it's safe and accessible so that would just be an application to for a special event for outdoor sales that that's the way that we can kind of give an oversight locally to outdoor sales so thank you for that and then that is perpetuated as long as it doesn't change if I could speak to the outdoor sales we put the outdoor sales for a reason it's actually a drawing card for people driving by and saying oh must be a market there even though you can clearly see that it's a market so in our experience in Ferndale whenever we put things outside it attracts people to come in they like it a lot especially during the spring and summer you know hours like right now we're actually closing down our outside sales post uh Halloween things just settle down nobody wants to shop outside and 40 degree weather or below and so we basically kind of tone that down a lot and basically sell firewood rock salt and but minimally it's it's not a big footprint but spring and summer we try to keep it contained to be a nice splash but not too much where it's like exactly what Andrea says I'm sure it's gonna be very nice when's the grand opening we hope for April 1st I don't know if that's so realistic probably you know May May 1st our developers pushing us a little bit to get it done get it out um and we're just about getting ready to do demo in there we still haven't been approved with the demo plan but we're getting some of the loose stuff that's in there now and then they'll come in and do a complete demo of the area so we can make it look like this instead of what it currently looks like it looks like a uh an older Rite Aid and i actually went into an older Rite Aid yesterday that has not been demoed completely and honestly it looks like a Rite Aid that got kind of some makeup on it we're taking a different route where we're trying to make it look so we're the

  46. come in they like it a lot especially during the spring and summer you know hours like right now we're actually closing down our outside sales post uh Halloween things just settle down nobody wants to shop outside and 40 degree weather or below and so we basically kind of tone that down a lot and basically sell firewood rock salt and but minimally it's it's not a big footprint but spring and summer we try to keep it contained to be a nice splash but not too much where it's like exactly what Andrea says I'm sure it's gonna be very nice when's the grand opening we hope for April 1st I don't know if that's so realistic probably you know May May 1st our developers pushing us a little bit to get it done get it out um and we're just about getting ready to do demo in there we still haven't been approved with the demo plan but we're getting some of the loose stuff that's in there now and then they'll come in and do a complete demo of the area so we can make it look like this instead of what it currently looks like it looks like a uh an older Rite Aid and i actually went into an older Rite Aid yesterday that has not been demoed completely and honestly it looks like a Rite Aid that got kind of some makeup on it we're taking a different route where we're trying to make it look so we're the alternative grocer when i say that i mean we're not as big as nino salvaggio but we carry a lot of the same products but we want to be in and out kind of what you've experienced at nine mile so it's 14 000 square foot average grocer is about 40 000. so we we feel that we're the alternative to the meyer kroger or the bigger footprint stores where people can kind of we want to be a neighborhood grocer but yet a cut above all right thank you they're scheduled for the november 17th planning commission okay great then i'll make the motion that we approve the submission and uh forward it along to the public planning commission support all in favor say aye aye pass three nothing and welcome to bloomfield township we wish you the best of luck by the way my son's a 13 year resident here in bluefield township part of the community nice great he's uh involved and uh i feel like this is going to be our new home so good wonderful great welcome glad to have you we're all excited thank you the ferndale store is going to have one last customer though so We know we might trace the Tuxford off, but we're excited about this location line. Many more. Yes. Nice. Under general business, anything for recent design review board approvals? Nothing. Nothing? And then our next meeting is Wednesday, November the 19th at 2 p.m.

  47. makeup on it we're taking a different route where we're trying to make it look so we're the alternative grocer when i say that i mean we're not as big as nino salvaggio but we carry a lot of the same products but we want to be in and out kind of what you've experienced at nine mile so it's 14 000 square foot average grocer is about 40 000. so we we feel that we're the alternative to the meyer kroger or the bigger footprint stores where people can kind of we want to be a neighborhood grocer but yet a cut above all right thank you they're scheduled for the november 17th planning commission okay great then i'll make the motion that we approve the submission and uh forward it along to the public planning commission support all in favor say aye aye pass three nothing and welcome to bloomfield township we wish you the best of luck by the way my son's a 13 year resident here in bluefield township part of the community nice great he's uh involved and uh i feel like this is going to be our new home so good wonderful great welcome glad to have you we're all excited thank you the ferndale store is going to have one last customer though so We know we might trace the Tuxford off, but we're excited about this location line. Many more. Yes. Nice. Under general business, anything for recent design review board approvals? Nothing. Nothing? And then our next meeting is Wednesday, November the 19th at 2 p.m. We'll see you then and move for adjournment. Move. We are adjourned. Thank you.